Talk:Alice Walton

Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment

This article was the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 10 January 2019 and 25 April 2019. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): CampyLane2019.

Above undated message substituted from Template:Dashboard.wikiedu.org assignment by PrimeBOT (talk) 13:51, 16 January 2022 (UTC)

Biography assessment rating comment

The article may be improved by following the WikiProject Biography 11 easy steps to producing at least a B article. -- KGV (Talk) 09:01, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

character

This article makes the person sound like a bitch, especially with her ultra conservative politics and killing a woman.

Is there not some better things to write about her?

The frankness about the crimes is a good thing, but I wonder why she drinks so much? 71.237.232.90 (talk) 01:23, 5 August 2012 (UTC)

Sources?

Where are the sources on the crimes she has been convicted of? 68.119.81.55 09:42, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Right here: http://www.forbesautos.com/advice/toptens/billionaire/09-alice_walton.html

--Gloriamarie 05:53, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

Philanthropy

The philanthropy section doesn't have a single source cited. -Xcuref1endx (talk) 20:51, 21 October 2014 (UTC)

Eh? But I just got another email from her saying how she wants to share her money with me! She included her Wikipedia link, so it must be my lucky day! Actually, it's just more abuse of Wikipedia and Wikipedia don't care. There should be some way to add a temporary warning to the abused Wikipedia articles--especially before the spammers get smart enough to vandalize the articles to support their scams more closely. Shanen (talk) 09:09, 24 January 2015 (UTC)

Alice Walton Tulsa anecdote

The following has elements of OR & can't go into the bio as is. Nevertheless, it's fun & interesting, and almost certainly true in its essentials:

Tulsa is rich in Walmart stores, and the pastor of a church my long-term Tulsa sister used to belong to noticed a long vacant one on East 71st St, on the way west to the Arkansas River. On a hunch, he called Walmart in Bentonville to inquire about converting the store to a church & community center.

Tulsa World story: Open Bible Fellowship Moves Into Former Wal-Mart Store, February 25, 1998. I happened to drive by the church, on my way to the River Park in Feb 2017, and asked my sister about it.

A woman with a deep-country Arkie accent answered, and the pastor asked about the vacant store. "Well, how much can you afford to pay" he was asked. He replied that he'd hoped the company would donate the old store. "Can't do it. Shareholders." he was told, but the woman did some calculations. "We could sell it for $2.5 million," she said, adding that that was about the value of the underlying land. Pastor Joel Budd talked to his congregation and then to bankers, who agreed to a loan, and Walmart agreed to sell for $2.3 million.. The store was remodelled, and attracts up to 1,000 worshippers on busy Sundays. Pastor Budd noted that there's always plenty of free parking.

Budd later found out that the woman who'd answered the phone, figured a price and sold him the old store was Alice Walton, by far the wealthiest woman in America. He's been dining out on the story ever since. Pete Tillman (talk) 20:37, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

Undue weight to drunk driving in lede?

While this is a well-documented personal problem & failing, I question whether it should occupy 1/3 of the lede of our wikibio. For instance, no lede mention of her extensive Art collection. --Pete Tillman (talk) 20:45, 22 February 2017 (UTC)

Request: Early life and education

Hi! I am working to update this page throughout and I noticed the formatting differs from other biography articles I have seen on Wikipedia. For instance, this article would better conform with other Wikipedia biographies if Education and career was separated into different sections. To that end I have created a proposed Early life and education section.

Early life and education
Early life and education Walton was born in Newport, Arkansas. She graduated from Trinity University in San Antonio, Texas, with a B.A. in economics and finance in 1971.

Markup

==Early life and education== Walton was born in [[Newport, Arkansas]].<ref name="Tedlow" /> She graduated from [[Trinity University (Texas)|Trinity University]] in [[San Antonio]], Texas, with a B.A. in economics and finance in 1971.<ref name="OConnor2013">{{cite news |last= O'Connor |first= Clair |url= http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoconnor/2013/09/16/inside-the-world-of-walmart-billionaire-alice-walton-americas-richest-art-collector/ |title= Inside the World of Walmart Billionaire Alice Walton, America's Richest Art Collector |work= Forbes |date= October 7, 2013}}</ref>

My hope is that an editor can create this new section, remove these details from the existing Education and career section and rename the existing section Career.

Are there editors who can assist with this? I will not direct edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared above. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 15:24, 7 July 2017 (UTC)

Hi Kt2011. Thanks for providing a citation for Alice Walton's educational background—I will add that to the article. But as for the remainder of your request, why should it be approved? I'm not convinced that the entirety of the "Education and career" section should be removed. It should be edited to be a little less laudatory, while still giving credit where credit is due. Some more citations for the unsourced paragraphs would be helpful also. But I don't think it's necessary to throw out the entire section. Altamel (talk) 22:47, 7 July 2017 (UTC)

References

Hi, Altamel! I apologize for any confusion. To be clear: I do not recommend deleting the career material from the article. Rather, I ask that the two sentences mentioned in my request above be broken off into their own section titled Early life and education. Then we can rename the section currently called Education and career to simply Career. Is that agreeable? Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 21:38, 10 July 2017 (UTC)

Hmm. In that case, my question is, why? Stylistically, I'm not a fan of level 2 sections that only have two sentences—paragraphs flow better. But perhaps you have some compelling reason for doing so? Altamel (talk) 18:38, 15 July 2017 (UTC)

Altamel, Here's where I am coming from with this request: After reviewing other biographies on Wikipedia, it appeared to me that many of them contained Early life and education sections with details on birthplace, schooling, etc. Certainly this section would be short, but perhaps it could be further developed later. Also, it struck me as odd that the article would include Ms. Walton's birthplace under Education and career, as one's birth is not connected to one's education nor their career. Thanks for considering, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 18:16, 17 July 2017 (UTC)

Fair enough,  Done Altamel (talk) 03:42, 20 July 2017 (UTC)

Altamel, thank you for making these edits. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 18:29, 20 July 2017 (UTC)

Request: Career

Hi! Continuing my work to update this article, I noticed Career needed attention. Most of Career is unsourced. Additionally, it is outdated. For example, Ms. Walton listed Rocking W Ranch for sale in 2015 and moved to Fort Worth, Texas, to focus on the Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art. I created a proposed Career section that tidies up the existing content, sources everything and adds a few extra details.

Career

Career In her early career, Walton was an equity analyst and money manager for First Commerce Corporation and headed investment activities at Arvest Bank Group. She was also a broker for E.F. Hutton. In 1988, Walton founded Llama Company, an investment bank, where she was president, chairwoman and CEO. Walton was the first person to chair the Northwest Arkansas Council and played a major role in the development of the Northwest Arkansas Regional Airport, which opened in 1998. At the time, the business and civic leaders of Northwest Arkansas Council found a need for the $109 million regional airport in their corner of the state. Walton provided $15 million in initial funding for construction. Her company, Llama Company, underwrote a $79.5 million bond. The Northwest Arkansas Regional Airport Authority recognized Walton's contributions to the creation of the airport and named the terminal the Alice L. Walton Terminal Building. She was inducted into the Arkansas Aviation Hall of Fame in 2001. In the late 1990s, Llama Co. closed and, in 1998, Walton moved to a ranch in Millsap, Texas, named Walton's Rocking W Ranch. An avid horse-lover, she was known for having an eye for determining which 2-month-olds would grow to be champion cutters. Walton listed the farm for sale in 2015 and moved to Fort Worth, Texas, citing the need to focus on the Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art, the Bentonville, Arkansas, art museum she founded that opened in 2011. In his 1992 autobiography Made in America, Sam Walton remarked that Alice was "the most like me—a maverick—but even more volatile than I am."

Markup

==Career== In her early career, Walton was an [[equity analyst]] and [[money manager]] for First Commerce Corporation<ref name="Hosticka 15">{{cite news |title=Arkansas Women's Hall of Fame: Alice walton |last1=Hosticka |first1=Alexis |url=https://www.nexis.com/docview/getDocForCuiReq?lni=5H1P-T3H1-JD2T-F10H&csi=280434&oc=00240&perma=true |newspaper=Arkansas Business |date=24 August 2015 |accessdate=8 May 2017}}</ref> and headed investment activities at Arvest Bank Group.<ref name="Gill 12">{{cite news |title=Alice Walton to receive honorary degree from the University of Arkansas |last1=Gill |first1=Todd |url=https://www.fayettevilleflyer.com/2012/02/16/alice-walton-to-receive-honorary-degree-from-the-university-of-arkansas/ |newspaper=Fayetteville Flyer |date=16 February 2012 |accessdate=8 May 2017}}</ref> She was also a broker for [[E.F. Hutton]].<ref name="OConnor2013"/> In 1988, Walton founded [[Llama Company]], an investment bank, where she was president, chairwoman and CEO.<ref name="Hosticka 15"/><ref name="Gill 12"/> Walton was the first person to chair the [[Northwest Arkansas Council]] and played a major role in the development of the [[Northwest Arkansas Regional Airport]], which opened in 1998.<ref name="The New Yorker">{{cite news |title= Alice's Wonderland: A Walmart Heiress Builds a Museum in the Ozarks |last= Mead |first= Rebecca |work= The New Yorker |date= June 27, 2011}}</ref> At the time, the business and civic leaders of Northwest Arkansas Council found a need for the $109 million regional airport in their corner of the state.<ref name="AP May 1999">{{cite news |title=Group to consider naming airport terminal after Wal-Mart heiress |url=https://www.nexis.com/docview/getDocForCuiReq?lni=3X4J-M5X0-00HV-6105&csi=8399&oc=00240&perma=true |newspaper=[[The Associated Press]] |date=8 August 1999 |accessdate=8 May 2017}}</ref> Walton provided $15 million in initial funding for construction.<ref name="AP May 1999"/> Her company, Llama Company, underwrote a $79.5 million bond.<ref name="AP May 1999"/> The Northwest Arkansas Regional Airport Authority recognized Walton's contributions to the creation of the airport and named the terminal the Alice L. Walton Terminal Building.<ref name="AP August 1999">{{cite news |title=Airport board names terminal after Alice Walton |url=https://www.nexis.com/docview/getDocForCuiReq?lni=3X5H-T190-00HV-60MP&csi=8399&oc=00240&perma=true |newspaper=[[The Associated Press]] |date=13 August 1999 |accessdate=8 May 2017}}</ref> She was inducted into the Arkansas Aviation Hall of Fame in 2001.<ref name="Cottingham 10">{{cite news |title=Alice Walton: Working to bring the world to Arkansas' door |last1=Cottingham |first1=Jan |url=http://www.arkansasbusiness.com/article/37302/alice-walton-working-to-bring-the-world-to-arkansas-door?page=all |newspaper=[[Arkansas Business]] |date=29 March 2010 |accessdate=8 May 2017}}</ref> In the late 1990s, Llama Co. closed and, in 1998, Walton moved to a ranch in [[Millsap, Texas]], named Walton's Rocking W Ranch.<ref name="OConnor2013"/><ref name="Paul 06">{{cite news |title=Alice Walton's big picture: The Wal-Mart heir turns her eye, and her money, to art collecting |last1=Paul |first1=Steve |url=https://www.washingtonpost.com/archive/lifestyle/2006/12/10/alice-waltons-big-picture-span-classbankheadthe-wal-mart-heir-turns-her-eye-and-her-money-to-art-collectingspan/231bcb7a-a011-43d0-81a0-d7155997d1e6/?utm_term=.c0458f00fda6 |newspaper=[[The Washington Post]] |date=10 December 2006 |accessdate=9 May 2017}}</ref><ref name="AP December 1999">{{cite news |title=Wal-Mart heiress loves cutting horses |url=https://www.nexis.com/docview/getDocForCuiReq?lni=3Y4X-F4X0-009F-S3J1&csi=280434&oc=00240&perma=true |newspaper=[[The Associated Press]] |date=19 December 1999 |accessdate=9 May 2017}}</ref> An avid horse-lover, she was known for having an eye for determining which 2-month-olds would grow to be champion [[Cutting (sport)|cutters]].<ref name="Kansas City Star">{{cite news |title= Alice L. Walton, Making a Grand Dream a Reality: The Jet-Setter Is Parlaying Her Wealth into a Hometown Museum |last= Paul |first= Steven |work= [[The Kansas City Star]] |date= November 19, 2006}}</ref> Walton listed the farm for sale in 2015 and moved to [[Fort Worth, Texas]], citing the need to focus on the Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art, the Bentonville, Arkansas, art museum she founded that opened in 2011.<ref name="Baker 16">{{cite news |title=Alice Walton cuts prices on two ranch properties |last1=Baker |first1=Max B. |url=http://www.star-telegram.com/news/business/article87248437.html |newspaper=[[Star-Telegram]] |date=1 July 2016 |accessdate=9 May 2017}}</ref><ref name="Sherman 15">{{cite news |title=Wal-Mart heiress selling these 'iconic' ranches for $48 million |last1=Sherman |first1=Erik |url=http://fortune.com/2015/09/17/walmart-alice-walton-ranch/ |newspaper=[[Fortune (magazine)|Fortune]] |date=17 September 2015 |accessdate=9 May 2017}}</ref><ref name="NPR 11">{{cite news |title=Wal-Mart heiress brings art museum to the Ozarks |url=http://www.npr.org/2011/11/08/142019716/wal-mart-heiress-brings-art-museum-to-the-ozarks |newspaper=[[NPR]] |date=8 November 2011 |accessdate=9 May 2017}}</ref> In his 1992 autobiography ''Made in America'', [[Sam Walton]] remarked that Alice was "the most like me—a maverick—but even more volatile than I am."<ref name="The New Yorker">{{cite news |title= Alice's Wonderland: A Walmart Heiress Builds a Museum in the Ozarks |last= Mead |first= Rebecca |work= The New Yorker |date= June 27, 2011}}</ref>

Are there editors who can assist with this? (Pinging Altamel, who responded to previous edit request). I will not direct edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared above. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:03, 25 July 2017 (UTC)

 Done Hi Kt2011, I've just looked at your request and I've implemented your edits. However, I'd advise you to look at the wording of 'avid horse-lover' - I know this was already in the article, but could this be better phrased so that it sticks to NPOV? It reads as if it were an autobiography. st170e 23:53, 29 July 2017 (UTC)

Hi, st170e! Thank you for making these edits. I have marked the edit request as answered rather than declined, since everything I asked for has been done. As to your point about the phrase "avid horse-lover", this language was already in the article, so I left it in my draft. However, if it is problematic, or you think it is NPOV, I say we remove that phrase altogether. That way, the sentence can read: "She was known for having an eye for determining which 2-month-olds would grow to be champion cutters." If that sounds agreeable to you, would you mind making the edit? Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 14:26, 1 August 2017 (UTC)

References

Request: Art

Hi! Continuing along. Art is fairly well developed. There are, however, a few places that could be tidier. Here's what I'm thinking.

• The last sentence of the first paragraph says Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art "is envisioned as … ". It seems a bit off to refer to a museum that has been open for nearly six years as "envisioned as". I propose we rewrite: "Crystal Bridges opened in November 2011 with hundreds of millions of dollars in art housed in 50,000 square feet of gallery space."
• In the middle of the second paragraph, this sentence does not read encyclopedic in tone: "Since almost every collector was at the auction, no one could figure out who on the phone was bidding such high prices." I propose we rewrite: "Collectors at the well-attended auction questioned who was placing successful bids over the telephone."
• In the following sentence, would it make sense to list some of the art that was bought that day? I propose we rewrite: "It was later learned that Walton purchased at least $20 million worth of art that day, including “Spring,” by Winslow Homer; “A French Music Hall,” by Everett Shinn; “The Studio,” by George Bellows; “The Indian and the Lily,” by George de Forest Brush; and “October Interior,” a by Fairfield Porter."
• I also suggest we add sources throughout this section
• Lastly, is it necessary to mention that Ms. Walton's 2005 purchase of Asher Brown Durand's Kindred Spirits was "a sealed-bid auction"?

This draft below includes all of the aforementioned changes.

Art

Art Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art, Bentonville, Arkansas Walton purchased her first piece of art when she was about ten years old. It was a reproduction of Picasso's Blue Nude she got from her father's Ben Franklin Dime-Store. She and her mother would often paint watercolors on camping trips. Her interest in art led to her spearheading the Walton Family Foundation's involvement in developing Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art in the heart of Bentonville, Arkansas. Crystal Bridges opened in November 2011 with hundreds of millions of dollars in art housed in 50,000 square feet of gallery space. In December 2004, the art collection of Daniel Fraad and wife, Rita, went up for public auction at Sotheby's in New York. Collectors at the well-attended auction questioned who was placing successful bids over the telephone. It was later learned that Walton purchased at least $20 million worth of art that day, including “Spring,” by Winslow Homer; “A French Music Hall,” by Everett Shinn; “The Studio,” by George Bellows; “The Indian and the Lily,” by George de Forest Brush; and “October Interior,” a by Fairfield Porter. She bid for most of the items while on a three-year-old gelding named IC LAD preparing to compete in the first qualifying round of the National Cutting Horse Association Futurity at the Will Rogers Coliseum in Ft. Worth, Texas. In 2005, Walton purchased Asher Brown Durand's celebrated painting, Kindred Spirits, for a purported US$35 million. The 1849 painting, a tribute to Hudson River School painter Thomas Cole, had been given to the New York Public Library in 1904 by Julia Bryant, the daughter of Romantic poet and New York newspaper publisher William Cullen Bryant (who is depicted in the painting with Cole). She has also purchased works by American painter Edward Hopper, as well as a notable portrait of George Washington by Charles Willson Peale. In 2009 at an undisclosed price, Crystal Bridges museum acquired Norman Rockwell's iconic "Rosie the Riveter" painting for its permanent collection. John Wilmerding, an advisor and board member to Crystal Bridges said Walton has collected the work of some artists in depth, quietly buying substantial bodies of work by Martin Johnson Heade, Stuart Davis, George Bellows and John Singer Sargent. Walton's attempt to quit smoking led to the purchase of two great smoking paintings by Alfred Maurer and Tom Wesselman. In a 2011 interview, she spoke about acquiring great works by other artists. She described Marsden Hartley as "one of my favorite artists—he was a very complex guy, somewhat tormented, but a very spiritual person, and love the emotion and the feel and the spirituality of his work". She went on to say, "and Andrew Wyeth—the mystery and loneliness that is expressed. How do you paint loneliness?"

Markup

==Art== [[File:Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art--2012-04-12.jpg|thumb|right|[[Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art]], Bentonville, Arkansas]] Walton purchased her first piece of art when she was about ten years old. It was a reproduction of [[Picasso]]'s ''Blue Nude'' she got from her father's Ben Franklin Dime-Store.<ref name="The New Yorker" /> She and her mother would often paint watercolors on camping trips.<ref name="The New Yorker" /> Her interest in art led to her spearheading the Walton Family Foundation's involvement in developing Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art in the heart of Bentonville, Arkansas.<ref name="The New Yorker"/><ref name="NPR 11"/> Crystal Bridges opened in November 2011 with hundreds of millions of dollars in art housed in 50,000 square feet of gallery space.<ref name="Smith 11">{{cite news |title=Crystal Bridges, the art museum Walmart money built, opens |last1=Smith |first1=Roberta |url=http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/27/arts/design/crystal-bridges-the-art-museum-walmart-money-built-review.html |newspaper=[[The New York Times]] |date=26 December 2011 |accessdate=11 May 2017}}</ref> In December 2004, the art collection of Daniel Fraad and wife, Rita, went up for public auction at [[Sotheby's]] in New York.<ref name="The New Yorker" /> Collectors at the well-attended auction questioned who was placing successful bids over the telephone.<ref name="The New Yorker" /> It was later learned that Walton purchased at least $20 million worth of art that day, including “Spring,” by [[Winslow Homer]]; “A French Music Hall,” by [[Everett Shinn]]; “The Studio,” by [[George Bellows]]; “The Indian and the Lily,” by [[George de Forest Brush]]; and “October Interior,” a by [[Fairfield Porter]].<ref name="The New Yorker" /> She bid for most of the items while on a three-year-old gelding named IC LAD preparing to compete in the first qualifying round of the National Cutting Horse Association Futurity at the Will Rogers Coliseum in Ft. Worth, Texas.<ref name="The New Yorker" /> In 2005, Walton purchased [[Asher Brown Durand]]'s celebrated painting, ''[[Kindred Spirits (painting)|Kindred Spirits]]'', for a purported US$35 million.<ref name="The New Yorker" /> The 1849 painting, a tribute to [[Hudson River School]] painter [[Thomas Cole]], had been given to the [[New York Public Library]] in 1904 by Julia Bryant, the daughter of Romantic poet and New York newspaper publisher [[William Cullen Bryant]] (who is depicted in the painting with Cole).<ref name="Kindred Spirits">{{cite web |url= http://www.nga.gov/exhibitions/durandinfo.shtm |title= Asher B. Durand's 'Kindred Spirits' |department= Exhibitions |publisher= National Gallery of Art}}</ref> She has also purchased works by American painter [[Edward Hopper]], as well as a notable portrait of [[George Washington]] by [[Charles Willson Peale]].<ref name="Vogel 05">{{cite news |title=A determined heiress plots an art collection |last1=Vogel |first1=Carol |url=http://www.nytimes.com/2005/05/14/arts/design/a-determined-heiress-plots-an-art-collection.html?_r=0 |newspaper=[[The New York Times]] |date=14 May 2005 |accessdate=11 May 2017}}</ref> In 2009 at an undisclosed price, Crystal Bridges museum acquired [[Norman Rockwell]]'s iconic "[[Rosie the Riveter#Saturday Evening Post|Rosie the Riveter]]" painting for its permanent collection.<ref>[http://www.rosietheriveter.org/painting.htm Rosie the Riveter] {{webarchive |url=https://web.archive.org/web/20090207091017/http://www.rosietheriveter.org/painting.htm |date=February 7, 2009 }}</ref><ref name="Brantley 09">{{cite news |title='Rosie the Riveter' to Crystal Bridges |last1=Brantley |first1=Max |url=https://www.arktimes.com/ArkansasBlog/archives/2009/06/08/rosie-the-riveter-to-crystal-bridges |newspaper=[[Arkansas Times]] |date=8 June 2009 |accessdate=11 May 2017}}</ref> [[John Wilmerding]], an advisor and board member to Crystal Bridges said Walton has collected the work of some artists in depth, quietly buying substantial bodies of work by [[Martin Johnson Heade]], [[Stuart Davis (painter)|Stuart Davis]], [[George Bellows]] and [[John Singer Sargent]].<ref name="Vogel 11">{{cite news |title= A Billionaire's Eye for Art Shapes Her Singular Museum |work= The New York Times |date= June 16, 2011 |first= Carol |last= Vogel |url= https://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/17/arts/design/alice-walton-on-her-crystal-bridges-museum-of-american-art.html }}</ref> Walton's attempt to quit smoking led to the purchase of two great smoking paintings by [[Alfred Maurer]] and [[Tom Wesselman]].<ref name="The New Yorker" /> In a 2011 interview, she spoke about acquiring great works by other artists. She described [[Marsden Hartley]] as "one of my favorite artists—he was a very complex guy, somewhat tormented, but a very spiritual person, and love the emotion and the feel and the spirituality of his work". She went on to say, "and [[Andrew Wyeth]]—the mystery and loneliness that is expressed. How do you paint loneliness?"<ref name="The New Yorker" />

Are there editors who can assist with this? (Pinging Altamel and st170e, who responded to previous edit requests). I will not direct edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared above. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 18:38, 8 August 2017 (UTC)

This request was not answered, so I opened it again. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:18, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

References

Partially implemented  Spintendo  ᔦᔭ  21:36, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

Request: Automobile incidents

I appreciate that editors are still considering my previous requests. While those remain open, I’d like to address the Automobile incidents portion of Personal life by bringing to your attention three points: 1) It details two car accidents that never resulted in charges, so I question their appropriateness in an encyclopedia; 2) The language used convicts Ms. Walton of a crime for which she was never charged nor convicted; and 3) It includes speculation. Here are points for your consideration:

• It details two incidents that never resulted in charges
  • The accident in Mexico was a single-vehicle accident from 34 years ago. No one other than Ms. Walton was injured in the crash, and it was never a legal issue.
  • The last paragraph details a 2011 DWI arrest for which charges were not filed.
  • In my opinion, these fall under WP:NOTNEWS and do not belong in an encyclopedia. Also, from WP:BLP: "Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid: it is not Wikipedia's job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives." However, if the 2011 arrest is to remain, I'd argue it needs to be edited, because it leads me to my next point.
• The language used convicts Ms. Walton of a crime for which she was never charged, nor convicted
  • The article says Ms. Walton "was again arrested for driving while intoxicated." Ms. Walton was arrested for allegedly driving while intoxicated. She was never charged with a crime, nor was she convicted of it. In fact, the arrest was expunged.
• It seems some of the copy includes speculation
  • The language around the 1989 accident it speculates that Ms. Walton "was speeding at the time of the accident." The official record shows that Ms. Walton was not charged with wrongdoing; anything suggesting otherwise is speculation and should be removed. To quote BLP: "A conviction is secured through judicial proceedings; accusations, investigations and arrests do not amount to a conviction."

With the above in mind and especially considering the two Wikipedia policies noted, I prepared a draft for your consideration. I appreciate your willingness to review and consider the suggested draft below.

Automobile incidents
Automobile incidents In a 1989 incident, Walton was driving when she struck and killed 50-year-old Oleta Hardin, who had stepped into a Fayetteville, Arkansas, road. Walton was not charged in the accident. In a 1998 incident, she was reported to have hit a gas meter while driving under the influence. She paid a $925 fine.

Markup

===Automobile incidents=== In a 1989 incident, Walton was driving when she struck and killed 50-year-old Oleta Hardin, who had stepped into a [[Fayetteville, Arkansas]], road.<ref name=OConnor2013/><ref name="Serwer 04">{{cite news |title=The Waltons: Inside America's richest family |last1=Serwer |first1=Andy |url=http://archive.fortune.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2004/11/15/8191093/index.htm |newspaper=[[Fortune (magazine)|Fortune]] |date=15 November 2004 |accessdate=11 May 2017}}</ref> Walton was not charged in the accident.<ref name="The New Yorker"/> In a 1998 incident, she was reported to have hit a gas meter while [[driving under the influence]]. She paid a $925 fine.<ref name="OConnor2013"/><ref>{{cite news |url= http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/the-woman-who-put-the-art-in-walmart-399462.html |title= The Woman Who Put the Art in Wal-Mart |date= November 8, 2007 |accessdate= April 23, 2011 |newspaper= [[The Independent]] |location= London}}</ref>

I will not direct edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared above. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 16:14, 4 December 2017 (UTC)

References

 Already done  Spintendo  ᔦᔭ  23:39, 8 December 2017 (UTC)

This request was not answered, so I opened it again. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:19, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

 Declined

1. The changes listed under the proposed markup mirror the text already emplaced in the article, which states:

   In an April 1989 incident, she struck and killed 50-year-old Oleta Hardin, who had stepped onto a road. Witnesses stated that Walton was speeding at the time of the accident, but no charges were filed. In a 1998 incident, she was reported to have hit a gas meter while driving under the influence. She paid a $925 fine and served no jail time.

2. The question over what the article's language suggests by stating "arrested for" in either incident is moot because those statements, when read to their conclusions, leave no doubt that while she may have been detained by law enforement — she was ultimately not charged by the legal authorities in those areas.
3. Additional proposals on this matter would go beyond the purview of the COI Edit Request System. In which case, may I suggest WP:CONTENTDISPUTE.
   

Regards,  Spintendo  ᔦᔭ  21:36, 12 December 2017 (UTC)

References

Hi, Spintendo. Thank you for reviewing this request. Just to clarify a couple points, my thought with your point #1 above is that the article currently says witnesses reported that Ms. Walton was speeding at the time of the accident. But since no charges were filed, it seems unfounded and I question if that particular detail belongs in the encyclopedia. Regarding your point #2: To me, the wording "was again arrested for driving while intoxicated" implies that the crime actually happened. This was an allegation and I think it should be reported as such, regardless if it is later written that she was never convicted of it. As for point #3, I had previously posted a request at WP:BLP/N and it is still open. I am also pinging Altamel and st170e, who have discussed previous edit requests here. I appreciate everyone's time and input. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 14:55, 18 December 2017 (UTC)

Under discussion at WP:BLPN#Alice Walton. --GRuban (talk) 16:11, 4 January 2018 (UTC)

Removed 2011 incident per discussion on WP:BLPN ... which no one else seems to have participated in. To summarize my reasoning, charges were dropped, and a mere arrest isn't very notable. --GRuban (talk) 16:03, 12 January 2018 (UTC)

Thanks again, GRuban! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:26, 12 January 2018 (UTC)

Request: Personal life

Hi! Another request here. This time I would like to finish out updating Personal life. I propose we replace the introduction to this section and the Family section with the following, while keeping the existing Automobile incidents section at the end.

The existing Personal life section begins with Ms. Walton's divorces and it seems to me that these are not particularly noteworthy. So you'll see in my draft that I have begun Personal life with information on Ms. Walton and her family, followed by net worth, residence, and a shortened sentence on her divorces.

Personal life

Personal life Alice Walton is the only daughter and youngest child of Walmart founder Sam Walton and Helen Walton. She has three brothers, Rob Walton, Jim Walton, and the late John T. Walton. She is niece of James "Bud" Walton and first cousin of Ann Walton Kroenke, Nancy Walton Laurie, and Sybil Robson Orr. As a Walmart heiress, Walton's net worth was $33.8 billion at the time of Forbes' annual The World's Billionaires list in 2017, making her the 17th richest person in the world, and the second-richest woman. She lives in Fort Worth, Texas. She married and divorced twice.

Markup

==Personal life== Alice Walton is the only daughter and youngest child of Walmart founder [[Sam Walton]] and [[Helen Walton]].<ref name="Business Insider 13">{{cite web |url=http://www.businessinsider.com/meet-the-waltons-wal-mart-family-tree-2013-10 |title=Meet the Waltons: A guide to America's wealthiest family |author=Megan Willett and Mike Nudelman |date=9 October 2013 |publisher=[[Business Insider]] |accessdate=11 May 2017}}</ref> She has three brothers, [[S. Robson Walton|Rob Walton]], [[Jim Walton]], and the late [[John T. Walton]].<ref name="Business Insider 13"/><ref name="Porter 07">{{cite news |title=Helen Walton, matriarch of Wal-Mart family, dies at 87 |last1=Porter |first1=Helen |url=http://www.nytimes.com/2007/04/21/business/21walton.html |newspaper=[[The New York Times]] |date=21 April 2007 |accessdate=11 May 2017}}</ref> She is niece of [[James "Bud" Walton]]<ref name="Business Insider 13"/><ref name="Vinton 16">{{cite news |title=Walton family members' fortune climbs $8.7 billion after strong quarter for Wal-Mart |last1=Vinton |first1=Kate |url=https://www.forbes.com/sites/katevinton/2016/05/19/walton-family-members-fortune-climbs-8-7-billion-after-strong-quarter-for-wal-mart/#7a150a6d79c3 |newspaper=[[Forbes]] |date=19 May 2016 |accessdate=11 May 2017}}</ref> and first cousin of [[Ann Walton Kroenke]], [[Nancy Walton Laurie]], and [[Sybil Robson Orr]].<ref name="Business Insider 13"/><ref name="Peacock 13">{{cite news |title=Keith Haring sculpture debuts at Crystal Bridges |last1=Peacock |first1=Leslie Newell |url=https://www.arktimes.com/RockCandy/archives/2013/04/24/keith-haring-sculpture-debuts-at-crystal-bridges |newspaper=[[Arkansas Times]] |date=24 April 2013 |accessdate=11 May 2017}}</ref> As a Walmart heiress, Walton's net worth was $33.8 billion at the time of ''Forbes''' annual The World's Billionaires list in 2017, making her the 17th richest person in the world, and the second-richest woman.<ref name ="ForbesBillionaires"/> She lives in Fort Worth, Texas.<ref name="Baker 16"/> She married and divorced twice.<ref name="OConnor2013"/>

Are there editors who can assist with this? I will not direct edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared above. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:23, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

References

Reply 30-JAN-2018

I'm leaving this template open to solicit other editor's responses. The COI editor wishes to replace information in this article regarding the descriptions of the subject's ex-husbands. That information is worded " Shortly thereafter she married a contractor who built her swimming pool, but they too quickly divorced.". Accordingly, I seek consensus on the wording as it stands now, and whether it should be altered. I put that question forward to other editors who may see this notice, and ask for their feedback. The passage in question is under the Personal life heading in the article. Regards, Spintendo ᔦᔭ 21:12, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

I agree it needs rephrasing. I don't agree it needs outright removal. The proposal is to name the subject's cousins, and yet to say nothing about her former husbands except to count them. That seems unbalanced; it's a rare person in whose life a marriage period played so little a part as to not deserve mention except to tick up a digit. Maybe we can give the years of each marriage and divorce, along with each former spouse's profession? I can imagine that the particular spouse built a swimming pool for her might not be too important.

I also wonder if the family and inheritance sections might be better in "early life", since "personal life" seems more things that she did, rather than things that happened to her. --GRuban (talk) 21:54, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

The main focus of the COI editor is to remove unflattering information regarding her failed marriage to a pool contractor. Make no mistake — the inclusion of the cousins is incidental; it is not their primary reason for the request.Spintendo ᔦᔭ 22:08, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

The wording is a direct quote from Clare O'Connor of Forbes magazine. I placed it in quotation marks, as it was not paraphrased. I now believe that the sentence is strongly referenced, and should remain in the article. Spintendo ᔦᔭ 22:20, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

(EC) I get that the request is more to remove the details on the spouses rather than to link the cousins. I'm not objecting to linking the cousins; if they're reasonably close relatives and have articles, it seems perfectly fine to link to their articles. I am objecting to just counting prior marriages; marriages are usually considered kind of a big deal. Even the article for Elizabeth Taylor, who had eight marriages, and who downplayed the significance of some of them, has a paragraph for each one. This article isn't that long, but neither is it a stub; surely each marriage is worth at least one descriptive sentence. --GRuban (talk) 22:23, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

I don't agree we need to keep in the pool. Is the pool really the most important thing about the marriage or the husband? Was it either the crowning achievement of his career, or the main reason for their relationship? Surely not. It seems condescending. His profession, yes, if you have to describe a person in only one sentence, mentioning their profession is a reasonably common way to do so, presumably it takes up a large and important portion of their life. I appreciate that it's a quote, but it's a flippant quote, and seems disrespectful, there is the strong implication that the marriage was a spur of the moment thing, without due consideration of the differences between the spouses. Unless we are specifically trying to say that - in which case, we need to give stronger evidence than a single quote - we can do better. --GRuban (talk) 22:44, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

I don't think there is anything flippant about it. I did at first, until I realized that the man or woman's career is mentioned because that's most often the first detail that accompanies a spouses description, such as "He married John Doe, a dentist from Cleveland". In Wedding announcements, the person's career is always mentioned, as it is in obituaries or other tidbits of news. If the opposition to a pool contracter also having their profession listed is because that would be embarrassing, that says more about our own personal prejudices regarding a pool contractor's insufficiency to marry an heiress more than anything else.Spintendo ᔦᔭ 23:33, 30 January 2018 (UTC)

I can debate further, but it may not be useful. @Kt2011: does the "who built her swimming pool" part make any difference to you? Or would changing to profession and dates of marriage be just as bad to you? (... assuming we can find the dates; I admit a bit of web searching doesn't reveal more than that one sentence, honestly...) --GRuban (talk) 16:36, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

Spintendo and GRuban -- Thanks for both of your replies here. First up, I want to clarify that I am fine with mentioning the divorces and, to me, the occupation of her former spouses isn’t a big deal; I’m ok with that wording either staying or going. With that said, I do want to understand more what the correct detail to include here is (this will also help me make sure that future requests I make are appropriate).

My suggestions for this section were based on better wording and conforming to BLP standards; my understanding is that such details should rely on extent of sourcing, and there isn't that much sourcing about her previous marriages. (As Elizabeth Taylor was given as a comparison earlier, by contrast, her marriages have been the topics of documentaries, books and many magazine articles.) The only reliable source I see that includes detail about Ms. Walton's ex-husbands is the Forbes article "Inside The World Of Walmart Billionaire Alice Walton, America's Richest Art Collector," which is cited in the article. Other reliable sources say that Ms. Walton is divorced, yes, but do not offer detail on her marriages. That is why my draft simplified the topic by saying "She married and divorced twice." This is how other reliable sources have handled Ms. Walton's marital status:

• The New Yorker: "Walton, who was married briefly in her twenties, has no children, and she has encouraged several of her nephews and nieces to develop an interest in art"
• The Washington Post: "Over the years, she married and divorced at least twice."
• Forbes: "MARITAL STATUS: Divorced"
• Business Insider: "Twice divorced with no children, Walton is also a lover of horses, which she breeds at Rocking W Ranch, located in Texas, and rides competitively."
• The New York Times: Ms. Walton, who is divorced, has no children."
• The Independent: "She's been married and divorced at least twice."

Other sources that include the same level of detail on Ms. Walton's marriages as the aforementioned Forbes article are websites such as salaryandnetworth.com and knownetworth.com. They offer no new detail beyond what is written in the Forbes piece or, as a result, appears on Wikipedia.

On the other details included in my suggestion... as Ms. Walton's cousins are already in the article, what I did was rearrange the family section slightly to make more sense and add some sourcing to support. As it is now, the article mentions one brother, then her cousins, then her two other brothers, followed by her father, mother and uncle. It makes more sense to me to start with her parents, siblings, uncle, and cousins. (As an aside, there has been much more written about the Walton family then Ms. Walton's divorces, so I do not find it overly detailed to include notable family members.) I had also suggested adding her current residence, which seemed straightforward, so I hope that can be added if you have no concerns. That would need to be updated in the Infobox, as well.

Finally, GRuban, I see you think net worth might better serve the article in another section, that seems fine to me and I'm open to your thoughts on that.

I appreciate your willingness to review, consider and discuss the suggested draft. Should we seek further input, perhaps we can ask other editors interested in WP:BLP how best to handle? Thanks again for your time on this one. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 18:27, 31 January 2018 (UTC)

It's been four days since any input was received, and there still seems to be no consensus here for these changes. I think your suggestion of WP:BLPN is an excellent idea.

Regards, Spintendo ᔦᔭ 16:10, 4 February 2018 (UTC)

Request: Automobile incidents (recent edit)

Hi! An editor added the 2011 automobile incident back into the article. As discussed on this talk page and Biographies of living persons in 2017, this incident never resulted in charges and was, in fact, expunged from the record. I'm bringing this to the attention of User:GRuban again as I believe this issue may fall under BLP guidelines. I welcome input from editors who are experienced in this area. I will not direct edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared above. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 17:46, 17 June 2019 (UTC)

Removed, per earlier discussion and WP:BLP. User:Paul F Villerius, if you still disagree, we can discuss here. --GRuban (talk) 18:21, 17 June 2019 (UTC)

Thanks again, GRuban! I'll continue to watch this Talk page if further discussion is needed. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:34, 18 June 2019 (UTC)

GRuban, is there some kind of policy that forbids reporting on incidents that were expunged from the record? That seems pretty antithetical to the point of archiving. Paul F Villerius (talk) 20:51, 18 June 2019 (UTC)

Paul F Villerius and GRuban: It is my understanding that the BLP guidelines cover issues such as these. As there have been more edits, I'm bringing this back to discuss here again. Here's the part of the guideline that I believe applies. WP:BLP: "Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid: it is not Wikipedia's job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives." In the current edits, I have two main concerns:

• "Despite an admission and witnesses that Walton was speeding at the time of the accident no charges were filed." This is written in a way that implies Ms. Walton was found to be at fault. The official record shows that Ms. Walton was not charged with wrongdoing. To quote BLP: "A conviction is secured through judicial proceedings; accusations, investigations and arrests do not amount to a conviction."

• "In 2011, Walton was arrested again for speeding and DUI. But despite video evidence which showed her failing a roadside sobriety test, the local prosecutors declined to press charges, while the trooper who performed the arrest was mysteriously suspended without pay. Three weeks later, a petition filed by her lawyers resulted in her arrest records being expunged." This material is not written neutrally and the arrest was expunged. As the Dallas News wrote, Ms. Walton had said that she "has an injured leg and couldn't perform balance tests under any circumstances", but that is not represented here.

As it seems these edits persist, and I suspect they will continue, I'm bringing this to editors to ask how best to address. What do we do to ensure that material that's written in the encyclopedia is encyclopedic, and not simply sensational? If Wikipedia editors decide that these details are essential to the article in some way, allegations should be presented as that: allegations. To say someone was "arrested again for speeding and DUI" implies that they were convicted of it. If that person was not convicted, the information should be presented as alleged to have happened.

I will not direct edit the article because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office. I will also post a message at BLP/N for other opinions. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 17:41, 28 June 2019 (UTC)

Sorry, Paul, don't know why I missed your comment on the 18th. Maybe try {{ping|GRuban}}? Anyway, Kt2011 basically has it right. WP:BLP says "Biographies of living persons ("BLPs") must be written conservatively and with regard for the subject's privacy." That doesn't mean we shouldn't include negative things about the subject if they're important, but we should leave them out if they're trivial. We discussed this incident on Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard/Archive263#Alice_Walton, where you'll see Kt2011 argue that all the automobile accidents that didn't result in charges should be removed, and I argued that the 1983 Acacupulco accident should be kept, since, even if it didn't result in charges and didn't affect anyone else, it resulted in noticeable long term or even permanent damage to the subject, including continuous pain and an injured leg, as the Dallas News writes about, above, and probably will for the rest of her life, so it's hard to argue it's not important. That's where we ended up. This 2011 arrest isn't important in that way; it didn't result in charges, it didn't affect anyone else, and it even had the arrest records expunged. Lots of people are arrested for traffic law violations, without it affecting them much at all, this seems to be one of these. Ms. Walton has the good or bad fortune of being notable enough that stories get written about events that affect her that generally wouldn't be written about if they had happened to anyone else. Have you seen the celebrity magazine articles about "movie star A spotted on beach!" "movie star B seen going to restaurant!" and other perfectly normal activities? We don't write about those either. Being arrested for a traffic law violation is, hopefully, not as common as going to a beach or restaurant, but I'd say it's closer to that than to a life changing event that should be forever inscribed on a person's biography. OK? --GRuban (talk) 18:17, 28 June 2019 (UTC)

User:GRuban, thank you for responding. I fully understand your explanation, but I still do not approve of the removal of the edit that I made. The arrest, expunged or not, was part of a single subject for which the article's subject has a section on, so to say that it's the same as posting a piece of gossip is erroneous. I'm glad that you sought to set a considerate bar of relevance, but the incident resulted in due process and media coverage. My edit used a credible source and neutrally conveyed the information from that source. It was specifically tailored to preclude an addition like that of User:69.40.2.25, which was inappropriate, lacking citation and using conspiratorial language. Like you said, an encyclopedia is not a tabloid or a biography; it is succinct but complete, relevant, and impartial. I await your response, and welcome any input from Kt2011 on how to remain fair to the subject without sacrificing the article's research integrity. {{ping|GRuban}} {{ping|Kt2011}} Paul F Villerius (talk) 05:39, 30 June 2019 (UTC)

And the due process resulted in (a) no charges, and even (b) expungement. Even without the expungement I don't think random traffic stops deserve mention in an encyclopedia article. --GRuban (talk) 12:28, 2 July 2019 (UTC)

GRuban, I understand your position, but please address the points I have put forth, rather than summize what you have. Thank you. {{ping|GRuban}} Paul F Villerius (talk) 11:47, 5 July 2019 (UTC)

Your points are that a reliable source wrote about Ms. Walton, and due process was involved. My response is that we don't write everything in BLPs that individual reliable sources do, especially due to the results of that due process which decided nothing should come of the event. The ping only works without the nowiki tags, and just linking my user name as you did, suffices. --GRuban (talk) 14:19, 5 July 2019 (UTC)

December 2019

Hi! An IP editor added the 2011 automobile incident and more detail about the 1998 incident. I wanted to bring this to the attention of User:GRuban and User:Paul F Villerius, who have discussed these issues with me here previously. As discussed on this talk page and Biographies of living persons in 2017, the 2011 incident never resulted in charges and was, in fact, expunged from the record. I still believe this issue may fall under BLP guidelines. Here's the part of the guideline that I believe applies. WP:BLP: "Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid: it is not Wikipedia's job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives." As GRuban wrote here previously, "the due process resulted in (a) no charges, and even (b) expungement. Even without the expungement I don't think random traffic stops deserve mention in an encyclopedia article".

I will not direct edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared above. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:33, 27 December 2019 (UTC)

 Done --GRuban (talk) 19:45, 27 December 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for calling Kt2011, but I'm a bit confused as to why this needs my attention. Care to elucidate? Paul F Villerius (talk) 16:42, 28 December 2019 (UTC)

Thanks again, User:GRuban! User:Paul F Villerius: It was simply a courtesy ping since you were involved in discussions here previously. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 13:53, 2 January 2020 (UTC)

Request: Introduction edit

Hi! An editor added this edit to the introduction of the article. This does not seem typical to me; can editors look and see if this should be removed? I'm bringing this to the attention of User:GRuban as I believe this issue may fall under BLP guidelines. Also, this incident is discussed later in the article. I welcome input from editors who are experienced in this area. I will not direct edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared above. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:06, 21 January 2020 (UTC)

 Done. Eww. Yes, that was a pretty blatant BLP violation. Thanks. --GRuban (talk) 21:00, 21 January 2020 (UTC)

Thanks again, User:GRuban! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 22:38, 21 January 2020 (UTC)

Request: Personal Life section (new edit)

Hi! An IP editor added this edit to "Personal life". This topic has been discussed on this talk page and Biographies of living persons in 2017, and again on this talk page in December 2019. The 2011 incident never resulted in charges and was, in fact, expunged from the record. I still believe this issue may fall under BLP guidelines. Here's the part of the guideline that I believe applies. WP:BLP: "Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid: it is not Wikipedia's job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives." Also, User:GRuban wrote here previously, "the due process resulted in (a) no charges, and even (b) expungement. Even without the expungement I don't think random traffic stops deserve mention in an encyclopedia article".

I will not direct edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared on this talk page. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 17:11, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

Removed as per previous discussion. --GRuban (talk) 17:25, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

Thanks yet again, User:GRuban! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 18:49, 29 September 2020 (UTC)

Walton Family Donations Lean Democrat

I'm removing the part that says her family is largely Republican because it is not accurate: https://www.forbes.com/sites/walterloeb/2020/10/07/walmarts-political-dichotomy-is-no-surprise/?sh=1ed82b1c2981 — Preceding unsigned comment added by DiscoStu42 (talk • contribs) 01:39, 1 February 2021 (UTC)

This family is great family. More of God blessings upon them. Bodengo (talk) 14:31, 15 June 2021 (UTC)

Request: Personal Life section (October 2021 edit)

Hi! An IP editor added these edits to "Personal life." This topic has been discussed several times on this talk page in 2017, 2019, and 2020, as well as Biographies of living persons in 2017. The 2011 incident never resulted in charges and was, in fact, expunged from the record. I still believe this issue may fall under BLP guidelines. Here's the part of the guideline that I believe applies. WP:BLP:

• "Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid: it is not Wikipedia's job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives."

Also, User:GRuban wrote here previously, "the due process resulted in (a) no charges, and even (b) expungement. Even without the expungement I don't think random traffic stops deserve mention in an encyclopedia article".

I will not directly edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared on this talk page. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 16:33, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

@Kt2011: Re-re-removed, as above. I don't recall if I asked, Kevin, would you have occasion to ask your principals whether they own and would be willing to release some images under a free license, like https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/4.0/? Or if you ever actually meet them and they would pose nicely for a photograph that you could take then upload? Or if you video chat, and could take a screenshot, likewise? Because there are quite a few articles listed on Walton Family that sadly lack an image: Bill Laurie; Nancy Walton Laurie; Whitney Ann Kroenke; Bud Walton; Josh Kroenke; Ann Walton Kroenke; Christy Walton; Lukas Walton; John T. Walton If you could so obtain one or more free images, we'd appreciate it. Not a requirement, but it would help everyone who reads any of these articles. Could you ask? --GRuban (talk) 19:37, 28 October 2021 (UTC)

Hi User:GRuban, thank you so much for reviewing the recent IP edits and for removing the BLP issue we've discussed several times now. As to your question on images, I apologize but I do not have any images that I can currently release under a free license. I will review the licensing information in the link you provided here and keep an eye open for opportunities where I may be able to secure such photos. I hope you understand. Thank you. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:21, 3 November 2021 (UTC)

curiosity

What is alice walton's email name? 116.206.31.64 (talk) 17:53, 5 February 2022 (UTC)

Enlightening

Hello I received an email stating you are wanting to BLESS me with money there are so many scams ,I am afraid to trust it anything. if this is not true please forgive me ,if you are in search on me reply back

Skeptic 2600:8800:16:BA00:30D0:4BF4:DD8B:517C (talk) 08:34, 8 August 2022 (UTC)

Philanthropy addition

Hi! I'm returning to suggest another round of updates to this article, which has become somewhat out of date over the past couple of years. To start, I propose adding a section on Ms. Walton's philanthropic work. I've prepared this content, the first sentence is moved from Political contributions:

Philanthropy

In 2016, Walton and other Walmart heirs donated $407 million in Walmart shares to a Family Trust which finances its philanthropy. Walton formed both the Art Bridges foundation and the Alice L. Walton Foundation in 2017. The Alice L. Walton Foundation promotes arts, education, health, and improving economic opportunity. In May 2020, the foundation gave a $1.28 million grant to the University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences to expand its program to provide healthy food in schools. Her foundation gave a $3.5 million grant to the Northwest Arkansas Food Bank in October 2022: $3 million to support construction of a food distribution center, and $500,000 to buy and distribute food. In 2020, the foundation gave the University of Central Arkansas $3 million in funding for its fine arts program. The foundation gave $10 million to the Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art in 2022 to support the museum's internship program to improve representation in arts leadership. Art Bridges partners with small and regional museums with less access to cultural resources. The foundation provides funding, collection loans and traveling exhibits, and creates art programs with museums. Walton has said her goal is to reduce the amount of art kept in storage. As of September 2021, the foundation had approximately 30 exhibits traveling throughout the United States. The foundation also has a fellowship program for people from historically underrepresented groups to work with its museum partners. Additionally, Walton has partnered with the Ford Foundation through Art Bridges to fund programs to improve diversity in museum leadership. Healthcare In 2021, the Alice L. Walton Foundation partnered with the Cleveland Clinic to evaluate health care in Northwest Arkansas. Following that evaluation, in 2022, the foundation and Washington Regional Medical System announced plans to create a nonprofit medical system aimed at training doctors in specialty care fields such as oncology, cardiology, and neurology. In 2019, Walton established the Whole Health Institute. The institute works with health systems, employers and communities to build and expand access to holistic healthcare. In March 2021, Walton announced that the institute would build a nonprofit medical school in Bentonville called the Alice L. Walton School of Medicine. The school will focus on allopathic medicine and graduates will receive a doctor of medicine degree. The campus will be located near Crystal Bridges. Construction is expected to begin in 2023, with the first class enrolling in 2025. References

I invite editors to review and give feedback or suggest changes. If you'd like to see all changes I plan to request, you can see them here. User:GRuban, you and I have worked together in the past and I'd welcome your assistance again.

I will not directly edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared on this talk page. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 17:03, 12 December 2022 (UTC)

Hi, Kt. It's a pleasure working with you. Since you're so good, though, I'd like to suggest some modifications to this change before I accept it.

• The first reference isn't actually to Forbes, it's to Fortune. They're not at all the same source.
• When the reference has a named author (in this case, Phil Wahba), it should be included. Others without authors that just say something like "staff" don't need them.
• That ref specifically mentions how much Alice Walton gave away. I'd specify something like "... $225 million among a total $447 million from Walmart heirs ..."
• I'd move the Art Bridges founding to the next paragraph which seems to be about it.
• The dates in the Alice Walton foundation paragraph seem to go in a weird order - 2020, then 2022, then 2020, then 2022 again. Is there a reason the events aren't chronological?
• "The foundation also has a fellowship program ..." - I'd just name it, since that is more specific and it is clear that it is from the foundation from the name."The Arts Bridges Fellows Program ... "
• Healthcare - again, why the 2021 paragraph first, then 2019?
• I see "Northwest Arkansas" is a formal region, we should probably link it.

If you find other things to improve while you're addressing those issues, please do. Thank you. --GRuban (talk) 16:12, 5 January 2023 (UTC)

@GRuban: It's a pleasure to work with you as well. Your feedback all makes sense to me.

• Good catch on the citation in the first sentence. I moved that in from Political contributions in the current article and didn't notice. I've cleaned up the citation, made the change you suggested and changed "Family Trust" to "Walton Family Holdings Trust" for clarity.
• Reorganized everything chronologically.
• Moved Art Bridges founding information. I also moved down the last sentence in the Alice L. Walton Foundation paragraph, which was about representation in arts leadership. There was a similar sentence in the Art Bridges paragraph, so I consolidated the two.
• Added a link to the Northwest Arkansas article.
• I added "pending accreditation" in the first paragraph of the Healthcare section to clarify that enrollment doesn't begin until accreditation is completed. The reference includes this phrasing.

Revised content below:

Extended content

In 2016, Walton donated $225 million among a total $447 million from Walmart heirs to the Walton Family Holdings Trust, which finances the family's philanthropy. Walton formed the Alice L. Walton Foundation in 2017. The foundation promotes arts, education, health, and improving economic opportunity. In 2020, the foundation gave the University of Central Arkansas $3 million in funding for its fine arts program. That year, the foundation also gave a $1.28 million grant to the University of Arkansas for Medical Sciences to expand its program to provide healthy food in schools. In 2022, Walton's foundation gave a $3.5 million grant to the Northwest Arkansas Food Bank: $3 million to support construction of a food distribution center, and $500,000 to buy and distribute food. Also in 2017, Walton formed the Art Bridges foundation. It partners with small and regional museums with less access to cultural resources. The foundation provides funding, collection loans and traveling exhibits, and creates art programs with museums. Walton has said her goal is to reduce the amount of art kept in storage. As of September 2021, the foundation had approximately 30 exhibits traveling throughout the United States. The Arts Bridges Fellows Program provides opportunities for people from historically underrepresented groups to work with its museum partners. Additionally, Walton has given $10 million to the Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art, and partnered with the Ford Foundation through Art Bridges to fund programs to improve diversity in arts leadership. Healthcare In 2019, Walton established the Whole Health Institute. The institute works with health systems, employers and communities to build and expand access to holistic healthcare. In March 2021, Walton announced that the institute would build a nonprofit medical school in Bentonville called the Alice L. Walton School of Medicine. The school will focus on allopathic medicine and graduates will receive a doctor of medicine degree. The campus will be located near Crystal Bridges. Construction is expected to begin in 2023, with the first class enrolling in 2025, pending accreditation. In 2021, the Alice L. Walton Foundation partnered with the Cleveland Clinic to evaluate health care in Northwest Arkansas. Following that evaluation, in 2022, the foundation and Washington Regional Medical System announced plans to create a nonprofit medical system aimed at training doctors in specialty care fields such as oncology, cardiology, and neurology. References

Let me know what you think. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 21:13, 11 January 2023 (UTC)

 Done --GRuban (talk) 20:55, 18 January 2023 (UTC)

Thanks again, User:GRuban! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 16:25, 19 January 2023 (UTC)

Request: Art

Hi! My next request is for the Art section. In the updated section below, I've incorporated my suggested changed with the existing article content:

• I added details about Alice Walton's interest in art as a child and early art purchases, and how it led to the creation of Crystal Bridges.
• At the end, I included a brief mention of other artists whose works Walton has purchased.
• The second paragraph was a single prose line sentence, so I incorporated it with the third paragraph which was also about Walton's art collecting.
• Citations 1 and 3 are named elsewhere in the article, so I did not include the full references below. #1 is this article from The New Yorker and #3 is this piece from W Magazine.
• I did some citation clean-up after noticing that the article from The New Yorker had two separate citations, so I gave them all the same ref name. Another link to an article from The Nation was dead so I updated it.

Art

Walton and her mother would often paint watercolors on camping trips. The first piece of art Walton purchased was a print of Picasso's Blue Nude when she was ten years old. In the late 1980s, she purchased a pair of display-quality Winslow Homer watercolors. Her interest in art led to the Walton Family Foundation developing the Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art in Bentonville, Arkansas. The architect Moshe Safdie designed the 200,000 square foot museum, which was built on 120 acres of Walton family land. The museum opened in 2011 and has been visited more than 5 million times as of 2021. In an interview with The Wall Street Journal, Walton said, "The motivation for Crystal Bridges was access for all and particularly for people who never had it." In December 2004, Walton purchased art sold from the collection of Daniel Fraad and Rita Fraad at Sotheby's, in New York. She acquired Asher Brown Durand's celebrated painting, Kindred Spirits, in a sealed-bid auction for a purported US$35 million in 2005. The 1849 painting, a tribute to Hudson River School painter Thomas Cole, had been given to the New York Public Library in 1904 by Julia Bryant, the daughter of Romantic poet and New York newspaper publisher William Cullen Bryant, who is depicted in the painting with Cole. She has also purchased works by American painters Winslow Homer and Edward Hopper, as well as a notable portrait of George Washington by Charles Willson Peale, in preparation for the opening of Crystal Bridges. In 2009, Walton acquired Norman Rockwell's "Rosie the Riveter" for $4.9 million. Walton's attempt to quit smoking inspired her to purchase a painting reminiscent of an earlier painting by John Singer Sargent by Alfred Maurer which depicts a full-length woman smoking. Another painting, by Tom Wesselmann, is titled "Smoker #9" and depicts a hyper realistic, disembodied hand and mouth smoking a cigarette. In a 2011 interview, she spoke about acquiring great works by other artists. She described Marsden Hartley as "one of my favorite artists-he was a very complex guy, somewhat tormented, but a very spiritual person, and I love the emotion and the feel and the spirituality of his work." She went on to say, "and Andrew Wyeth-the mystery and loneliness that is expressed. How do you paint loneliness?" Other artists whose work Walton has purchased include Georgia O'Keeffe, Mark Rothko, Edward Hopper, Kehinde Wiley, and Titus Kaphar. References

I invite editors to review and give feedback or suggest changes. If you'd like to see all changes I plan to request, you can see them here. User:GRuban, are you up for reviewing another one of my requests?

I will not directly edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared on this talk page. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 14:34, 23 February 2023 (UTC)

@Kt2011: OK, I think I added the content you wanted, but in a different order. Also a picture from your 2017 request! If I missed something, or you want other changes, please ping. --GRuban (talk) 23:48, 7 March 2023 (UTC)

Personal life and recognition

Hi! I've got a few more changes to suggest for the article.

• Move "In 1998, Walton moved to a ranch in Millsap, Texas, named Walton's Rocking W Ranch. An avid horse-lover, she was known for having an eye for determining which 2-month-olds would grow to be champion cutters. Walton listed the farm for sale in 2015 and moved to Fort Worth, Texas, citing the need to focus on the Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art." from Career to Personal life

• I think these details are more representative of her personal interests than career interests, and the information about where she has lived is more appropriate in the Personal life section.

• Add "She moved back to Bentonville in 2020." to Personal life

• If the information about the ranch is moved, I think this could go on the end of that paragraph.

• Add notable recognition. I've collected a few of these that I think have sourcing adequate for inclusion and listed them in the box below. I am not sure if they fit better in their own section or maybe as part of Personal life?

Below is how I imagine the Personal life section would look with the moves and addition, and the recognitions that could be added to the article.

Personal life + recognition

Personal life Walton married a prominent Louisiana investment banker in 1974 at age 24, but they were divorced 21⁄2 years later. According to Forbes, she married "the contractor who built her swimming pool" soon after, "but they, too, divorced quickly". Walton has been involved in multiple automobile accidents, one of them fatal. She lost control of a rented Jeep during a 1983 Thanksgiving family reunion near Acapulco and plunged into a ravine, shattering her leg. She was airlifted out of Mexico and underwent more than two dozen surgeries; she suffers lingering pain from her injuries. In April 1989, she struck and killed 50-year-old Oleta Hardin, who had stepped onto a road in Fayetteville, Arkansas. In 1998, she hit a gas meter while driving under the influence of alcohol. She paid a $925 fine. In 1998, Walton moved to a ranch in Millsap, Texas, named Walton's Rocking W Ranch. An avid horse-lover, she was known for having an eye for determining which 2-month-olds would grow to be champion cutters. Walton listed the farm for sale in 2015 and moved to Fort Worth, Texas, citing the need to focus on the Crystal Bridges Museum of American Art. She moved back to Bentonville in 2020. Recognition Time magazine most influential people in the world, 2012 Smithsonian Institution's Archives of American Art Medal, 2013 International Women's Forum hall of fame inductee, 2018 Getty Medal, 2020 References

One other question: the picture in the Infobox is quite old, would editors be open to replacing it with the picture seen here? I've got permission to donate it to Wikimedia, and wanted to check in before I go through that process.

Feedback and questions are welcome here or on my Talk page.

@GRuban: Thank you for all of your help here and with Rob Walton's birthday! If you've got time for one more request, your help is much appreciated.

As always, I will not directly edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared on this talk page. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 14:52, 29 March 2023 (UTC)

Will look at the other edits, and probably implement. Re the picture question, depends on who "editors" will be! Let me direct you to https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Commons:Deletion_requests/File:Ana_Ularu_on_HotNews_Romania.jpg. To summarize, three years ago, I uploaded an image of a Romanian actress for our article about her. I do that sort of thing occasionally. She didn't like it, and asked that it be removed. I said we wouldn't do that, as it was an accurate and not terrible image, but if she could release one she liked better we'd be happy to replace it with that better one. Just this year, she did that, releasing a noticeably better image. I was grateful, and as promised replaced it basically everywhere (we've got short articles about her in 13 languages), and when she asked that the first one be deleted completely, I nominated it for deletion, thinking "other editors" would agree. I was wrong! The older image is still in use on the DE (German) wikipedia article about her, and a couple of editors said they (1) didn't like to do things just because article subjects asked, and (2) actually preferred the older image, because it makes her look more human. So ... I, personally, would be glad to replace the current Alice Walton image with the one you suggest, to me both are equally good, so we might as well use the one that article subject prefers. If you upload it and release it properly, I will try to do that. However, I am not the only voice here, and as demonstrated in the case I have described and linked, there is a non-zero chance that "other editors" will disagree. --GRuban (talk) 17:09, 29 March 2023 (UTC)

@GRuban: Wikipedia never ceases to amaze! I really appreciate the context and heads up. I'll go ahead and get the donation process started and let you know when it's up. Meantime, let me know if you have any questions about the edits as you're reviewing. Thanks! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 15:45, 30 March 2023 (UTC)

@GRuban: The photo has been uploaded here and the release process is complete. Thanks! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 14:19, 10 April 2023 (UTC)

@Kt2011:  Done. I cropped the image to focus on her (the sides were rather blurry and didn't add much), and moved the previous image down since it does show her looking noticeably different, and you didn't say she outright hated it, just preferred this one. If she does want it gone entirely we can probably do that, it doesn't add that much, she isn't notable for her visual appearance. I also added a few links to Recognition, and notice one of the references was about her receiving an honorary degree from a college, that's not nothing, want that there too? --GRuban (talk) 23:07, 22 April 2023 (UTC)

@GRuban: This is terrific, thank you! Happy to have the other image stick around, and if you'd like to add the honorary degree, that would be great. Sounds like you already have a source for that, but just in case, here is another. Thanks again! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 21:43, 24 April 2023 (UTC)

Recent Personal life edits

Hi editors, I noticed that an editor recently made an edit similar to others made in the past. This content has been discussed fairly often (in 2017, 2019, 2020, and 2021, as well as on the Biographies of living persons noticeboard in 2017) and each time has been removed for ultimately being non-encyclopedic and going against this clause in WP:BLP: "Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid: it is not Wikipedia's job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives."

GRuban, would you be willing to revert this change? As always, I won't make direct changes due to my conflict of interest. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 13:30, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

Reverted, mainly because "many" was unsourced. --GRuban (talk) 16:31, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

Thank you! Appreciate your assistance. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 17:31, 27 June 2023 (UTC)

Recent vandalism

Hi editors, I noticed that a pair of edits were recently made that are pretty clear vandalism, adding a random name and phone number.

GRuban, I hate to bother you again so soon, but would you be willing to revert this change? As always, I won't make direct changes due to my conflict of interest. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 14:13, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

 Done I have reverted it. Thanks! (Reverting clear vandalism is allowed by anyone per WP:COIADVICE, but I appreciate that you also wanted to do everything unambiguously by the book, so pinging someone about this was a good choice as well.) DanCherek (talk) 16:38, 3 July 2023 (UTC)

@DanCherek: Thank you very much! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 20:11, 5 July 2023 (UTC)

Recent edits

Hello editors, I noticed some recent edits by an IP editor that seem to be pretty clear cases of vandalism, changing dates and the abbreviation for the United States. @DanCherek and GRuban: would either of you be willing to review and revert these changes? I'd appreciate it. Due to my COI I'll hold off on fixing this myself. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 16:07, 28 August 2023 (UTC)

@Kt2011:  Done, thanks for pointing this out! DanCherek (talk) 16:16, 28 August 2023 (UTC)

@DanCherek: Thanks for the help! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 18:18, 28 August 2023 (UTC)

Request: Personal Life section (new edit)

Hi! The "Personal life" section was edited again to include an incident that has been discussed several times on this talk page in 2017, 2019, 2020, 2021 as well as Biographies of living persons in 2017. The 2011 incident never resulted in charges and was, in fact, expunged from the record. I still believe this issue may fall under WP:BLP guidelines, particularly:

• "Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, not a tabloid: it is not Wikipedia's job to be sensationalist, or to be the primary vehicle for the spread of titillating claims about people's lives."

Also, User:GRuban wrote here previously, "the due process resulted in (a) no charges, and even (b) expungement. Even without the expungement I don't think random traffic stops deserve mention in an encyclopedia article".

I will not directly edit this page because I have a Wikipedia:Conflict of interest; I work with the Walton family office, as I disclosed on my user page and declared on this talk page. Thanks, Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 19:56, 22 May 2024 (UTC)

These previous discussions are all you agreeing with GRubin GRuban, which does not amount to a consensus to keep this material out of the article. Gamaliel (talk) 17:57, 23 May 2024 (UTC)

Er:

• I'm GRuban, actually; no i;
• If you read deeper into the previously linked discussions, you'll see we originally disagreed on multiple issues, which Kt also wanted removed, and I insisted be left in;
• and consensus does seem to be evidenced by the fact that the decision has been made this way for the past seven years and five different occasions,
• they were not just Kt and myself discussing, but multiple other people who wanted to put the content in, and eventually gave in, which is one of the more common ways consensus is made around here.

Consensus can, of course, change, so it's not tremendously useful to argue whether or not there was one, the key point is whether or not there is one now. But I will ask you to address the reasoning behind the decision, consensus or not, which was:

• This article is a WP:BLP, which "must be written conservatively and with regard for the subject's privacy".
• The issue in question was a DWI traffic stop, in general a misdemeanor. In general we do not mention misdemeanors on BLPs; they're just not big enough of a deal, considering the previous point.
• The issue in question was expunged from Walton's record. We aren't here to overrule that legal decision.

Also, I have to say, the specific way you wrote the sentences is basically a BLP violation - you're implying that Walton used her influence to get the arresting officer suspended, which is a really big deal, and I'm surprised you are writing it that way given your experience. We don't write that sort of damning allegation against a living person unless we have very strong proof from highly reliable sources. But that's not one of the three points I'm asking you to address, as I was and intend to be removing previous versions of the story that didn't make that implication. Anyway, please do respond to the points. --GRuban (talk) 19:16, 23 May 2024 (UTC)

Apologies for spelling your user name wrong. I'm often the victim of that myself. While I don't believe the edit was a BLP violation, I'm certainly open to rewording my edit in a manner that is mutually satisfactory. In regards to your points, a legal expungement does not mean the incident never happened for our purposes and IMO doesn't have any bearing on inclusion, what's far more significant is if reliable sources report on it. I admit I don't know what the general threshold is for inclusion of alleged offences, but I'm not aware of any rule or precedent that prohibits inclusion of misdemeanors. If there is please make me aware of it. Gamaliel (talk) 19:56, 23 May 2024 (UTC)

Thanks! We're getting somewhere. There isn't a specific rule about inclusion of traffic stops that I know, but there is the general "write BLPs conservatively and with regard to subject privacy" bit, which is policy. I would argue that means not to include minor controversies, of which this is one. We also generally don't accuse people of crime unless there is a conviction. This incident was not only not a conviction, it was actually expunged from her record, which is the opposite of a conviction. --GRuban (talk) 20:48, 23 May 2024 (UTC)

Thank you User:GRuban for reviewing this request, and User:Gamaliel for your feedback. I do believe that because the arrest was expunged from the record, and because the incident never resulted in any charges, it does not belong in an encyclopedia article. If we think it is best to revisit this at WP:BLP/N, I'm happy to bring it up there. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 22:06, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

Update: I have posted a new message at BLP/N. Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 22:06, 4 June 2024 (UTC)

I recently posted to BLP/N in an effort to come to a consensus on this issue. However, I did not receive any constructive replies about the content. Gamaliel, Do you have any other suggestions for how we can come to consensus on this? Thanks very much! Kt2011 (Talk · COI:Walton family) 21:38, 19 June 2024 (UTC)

Kt2011, looks like you wanted to ping Gamaliel just above there (or possibly both of us), and instead only pinged me. You want

{{u|Gamaliel}} or {{ping|GRuban|Gamaliel}} not {{u|GRuban|Gamaliel}}

But the fact you did ping me may be to the good, since I'm surprised to see that this text wasn't removed. From your 4 June message, I got the impression that it was removed. See, Gamaliel, as an administrator, should know that it is, in fact, his responsibility to gain consensus for adding this information. It is not our responsibility to gain consensus for removing it. That's true for all articles, but especially for contested information in WP:BLPs. Now, I'd be happy if he were to start an RFC, and discuss it, that's far preferable to just reverting. But he hasn't. He just restored the contested information, without responding to our objections. So I'm going to put this in writing. User:Gamaliel, either:

• leave the information out, or
• establish consensus to have it, whether by convincing us here, or by convincing many other editors in an RfC, or
• be blocked.

Really. I am sorry to write in this tone, and I wouldn't be, if you weren't an experienced editor, and an administrator, as you can see, I didn't in the previous incidents. But you are an experienced editor an administrator. You should know this. --GRuban (talk) 18:52, 20 June 2024 (UTC)