From Talk:Ali/Archive4

References

There are few reference in English about Islam. So how can I use original reference (Arabic and Persian) in this article.--Sa.vakilian 06:31, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

You can't. And the references you just added do not pass muster. A Shi'a website is not a scholarly or authoritative source. Where is the documentation of early hadiths? Where are they published. What sources do US universities use to research Ali? I'm going to add back the unreferenced tag, because nothing significant has been added. Cuñado

- Talk 06:52, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with you and I don't want to use Shiite weblogs. Unfortunately there is few reference in English about Islam especialy Shiism. But i can use a wide source of original text in Arabic or Persian. --Sa.vakilian 08:32, 8 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Cuñado tell me for what paragraph or sentence do you need reference for. I am going to try my best to find the reference because I am not going to let a small thing like this mess up the page of my first Imam. So you tell me the reference you need and I am going to provide you with the sources. Okay, Thank YouSalman 03:42, 10 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Well one significant piece of work is to convert all the references into <ref> tags. See Wikipedia:Footnotes. This will create in-text links which are small and can reference a book and page number. Any time a Hadith is mentioned, or any fact about Ali's life, there should be a footnote to a reputable source. Undocumented Hadiths have virtually destroyed Islam, and people have created rumors which are spread as if they are of divine origin. If you can't find a good source of hadiths, not in website form, then they should not be mentioned and they should be t reated as false.

As for the life of Ali, find some books that were not written by Muslims. Check university websites for what sources they use, and find those books. Read them, and edit the page while inserting footnotes to the book with a page number.

That's a good place to start. I also have enormous veneration and respect for Ali, and I want to see the article well written, but I don't have much knowledge of the subject, and especially not enough knowledge of sources. Cuñado

- Talk 04:24, 10 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Cuñado I really appreciate your efforts to make this article perfect. Since you are the one saying that some of the things that are being said in this article needs references, can you please tell me the paragraph(s) and sentence(s) that need references and sources. It will be easy for me to get references and sources like that and then no one is going t have any problem what the article is saying about Imam Ali ibn Abu Talib (AS). Thank You Salman 16:56, 10 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

OK I just re-worked about half the article. I removed the really poor references which were unsourced web pages, and I added "citation needed" tags where I felt references were much lacking. I also added comments to some of the tags which are not displayed. I'll work on it more a little later. Cuñado - Talk 01:36, 11 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Regarding this edit... The websites you add are not good sources. If you find a source which uses (PBUH) and other honorifics, or refers to Ali as "his holiness Ali", then it has a bias and is not an academic source. You also deleted some of the 'uncited' tags without inserting anything. Al-Balagh does not appear to be a good source. Their website says nothing about who they are or where they get information. If the source doesn't have a wikipedia page, that's a good sign that it's a bad source. Try researching the Library of Congress. Cuñado

- Talk 01:19, 18 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Tafsir Almizan

I added a quotation from Tafsir al-Mizan which is a valid source[1] and [2]--Sa.vakilian 12:05, 1 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Al-shia.com

This site [3] is reliable among Shiites. According to it "This Center whose goal is to spread the Shi`ite culture through the WEB and create a kind of strong relation between the theological class and the public, is being managed under the supervision of the office of His Eminence, Grand Ayatollah Sistani (may Allah protect him)." So we can refered to it.--Sa.vakilian 07:37, 2 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Sunni and Shiite viewpoint

Although there are too many similarities between Sunni and Shiite about Ali but I propose adding one Shiite and one Sunni reliable reference in each case.--Sa.vakilian 07:39, 2 September 2006 (UTC)[reply]

AGREE...why isnt that already done??? They should have a bio with facts and then a Shia/Sunni view point. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.243.211.138 (talk) 00:23, 1 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]