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Talk:Adnan al-Bursh

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Did you know nomination

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by SL93 talk 23:00, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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  • ALT: ...that Palestinian orthopedic surgeon Adnan al-Bursh served as an adviser to the Palestine national football team?
    • Created by Makeandtoss (talk) and Iskandar323 (talk). Number of QPQs required: 1. Nominator has 41 past nominations.

    Makeandtoss (talk) 13:24, 9 May 2024 (UTC).[reply]

    @48JCL: For someone who rose to prominency for being killed, his death is certainly central to his biography and by extension the hook, as demonstrated by the overwhelming majorit of RS reporting on him.
    @BlueMoonset: Can you please elaborate what is meant with a full review? Makeandtoss (talk) 14:31, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Proposing ALT2 which combines the original hook and ALT1: that doctor Adnan al-Bursh, who recently died in Israeli prison, had served as an adviser to the Palestine national football team? Makeandtoss (talk) 15:27, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    You can't have "recently" in a hook per WP:DYKHOOK, the hook's fact must not be likely to change. In theory, you could include "who died in April 2024" to get around this. However, I would expect a more merciless prepbuilder to take it out per WP:DYKTRIM.--Launchballer 16:26, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Thanks for the important point; hopefully all the prepbuilders are merciful.. Amending then to ALT2a: that doctor Adnan al-Bursh, who died in Israeli prison in April 2024, had served as an adviser to the Palestine national football team? Makeandtoss (talk) 15:27, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Full review needed (which for your information is the criteria listed at WP:DYKRI).--Launchballer 16:47, 20 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    General: Article is new enough and long enough
    Policy: Article is sourced, neutral, and free of copyright problems
    Hook: Hook has been verified by provided inline citation
    QPQ: Done.
    Overall: @Makeandtoss: The article is new enough, having been created May 5 and nominated May 9. At 5,139 characters it's long enough. Every paragraph and quotation is sourced, and I was able to verify the hook information and spot-checked throughout the article. The article is written neutrally, avoiding sensationalism and properly attributing noteworthy subjective reactions and assessments to institutions, individuals, communities, etc. as appropriate. The hook is interesting; there are plenty of doctors who advise sports teams (sports medicine, after all), even national sports teams, but I don't generally expect someone so prominent to die in prison. What brought on this circumstance, a reader is prompted to wonder—and thus was I drawn to this hook and article, and so also I expect a main page reader will be drawn.
    However, before approving, there is some close paraphrasing I noticed using Earwig that I'd like to see resolved:
    From the article: Al-Bursh's wife and six children also refused to move south and instead took shelter in one of the UNRWA schools in the northern Gaza Strip: This strikes me as too close of a paraphrase of His wife and six children didn't leave either, and they are currently taking shelter in one of the UNRWA schools in the north of the Gaza Strip, in The National News.
    From the article: injured while at the Indonesian Hospital while he was in the operating room: This seems too close of a paraphrase of injured while we were at the Indonesian Hospital as Israeli forces surrounded us for four days, while he was in the operating room, in The National News.
    If these could be rephrased or reorganized to be more distantly phrased, that would be ideal. Otherwise, I'm ready to approve the nomination. Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 00:12, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    @Hydrangeans: Thanks for the detailed review. I have rephrase the parts you mentioned, but self-reverted in case of 1RR situation, if you could revert me then this issue would be solved.

    Also, as you said, his torture was the cause of death, and should be mentioned uncontroversially since this is what all RS had reported on. I would suggest this: ALT2b: that doctor Adnan al-Bursh, who died from torture in Israeli prison in April 2024, had served as an adviser to the Palestine national football team? I prefer ALT2b but wouldn't object to ALT2a if there is more agreement to it. Makeandtoss (talk) 13:56, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]

    @Makeandtoss: Thanks for the rewrite of those sentences. I performed the requested revert of your self-revert (I'll admit that this particular intersection of rules is arcane to me and I don't entirely understand). I didn't bring up torture being the cause of death, and I think putting it in the hook is to your detriment; it removes questions and curiosity by providing too many answers up front. I also think it might read better if reordered. The most surprising information is his passing in prison, but you place that before him being adviser to the national football team, making it so that rhetorically the hook seems to be trying to make the latter the 'punch' (or the surprising bit) even though it's not as surprising or interesting. I realize we've gone through a couple drafts of this hook already, but would it be possible to rewrite the hook to set up who he is first and then finish the hook with what happened? Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 16:10, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Good points, then ALT2c should be GTG: that orthopedic surgeon Adnan al-Bursh had also served as an advisor to the Palestine national football team before dying in Israeli prison in April 2024?Makeandtoss (talk) 16:14, 21 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    @Makeandtoss: It would need to be 'in an Israeli prison'. Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 16:53, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    @Hydrangeans: I think the original version also works as there is no need to specify a specific one. Makeandtoss (talk) 17:08, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    It's not about specifying a certain one (because the 'a prison' is already rendering it nonspecific); it's ungrammatical. Consider the difference between "she worked at American restaurant" (missing an article) versus "she worked at an American restaurant" (the article an is properly there). Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 20:05, 24 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    @Hydrangeans: Fine with me: that orthopedic surgeon Adnan al-Bursh had also served as an advisor to the Palestine national football team before dying in an Israeli prison in April 2024? Makeandtoss (talk) 09:30, 25 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]
    Thank you; the nomination of the typo-corrected ALT2c, immediately above, is approved. (ALT0 was not approved because of WP:DYKHOOK, and ALT1 wasn't approved because of WP:DYKINT.) Hydrangeans (she/her | talk | edits) 18:05, 26 June 2024 (UTC):[reply]
    For pshaw tool use - ALT2C ... that orthopedic surgeon Adnan al-Bursh had also served as an advisor to the Palestine national football team before dying in an Israeli prison in April 2024? SL93 (talk) 22:59, 26 June 2024 (UTC)[reply]


    duplicates

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    I've removed one duplicate paragraph but this needs more. Secretlondon (talk) 12:33, 2 July 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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