Talk:AFAB queen

This article is part of WikiProject Gender studies. This WikiProject aims to improve the quality of articles dealing with gender studies and to remove systematic gender bias from Wikipedia. If you would like to participate in the project, you can choose to edit this article, or visit the project page for more information.Gender studiesWikipedia:WikiProject Gender studiesTemplate:WikiProject Gender studiesGender studies articles

???

This article has not yet received a rating on the project's importance scale.

To-do list:

Here are some tasks awaiting attention:

Assess : see Unassessed Gender studies articles and Unknown-importance Gender studies articles
Cleanup : edit to see
Collaborate : see /Collaboration
Copyedit : edit to see
Deletion sorting : see /Sexuality and gender
Expand : edit to see
Infobox : see Gender studies articles needing infoboxes
Merge : edit to see
Notability : edit to see
NPOV : edit to see
Orphans : Brannon Masculinity Scale · Holy Virility · Media and gender · Michael Kaufman (author) · Women's education in Saudi Arabia
Photo : see Wikipedia requested photographs of gender studies
Split : History of feminism
Stubs : see Gender studies stubs
Translate : see /translation
Update : edit to see
Verify : Riot grrrl
Needs attention : see Gender studies articles needing attention

LGBTQ+ studies

This article is of interest to WikiProject LGBTQ+ studies, which tries to ensure comprehensive and factual coverage of all LGBTQ-related issues on Wikipedia. For more information, or to get involved, please visit the project page or contribute to the discussion.LGBTQ+ studiesWikipedia:WikiProject LGBTQ+ studiesTemplate:WikiProject LGBTQ+ studiesLGBTQ+ studies articles

Rename article to Faux Queen

This article, as even the one source referenced, should be renamed to Faux Queen. Benjiboi 23:18, 1 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Done. Bio queen is now a redirect to faux queen. Oh, and I've removed the transwiki tag from this talk page because it hasn't been transwikied under the new name and doesn't appear to be there under the old one either (probably deleted from wikitionary). --AliceJMarkham 00:19, 2 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

thank you! Benjiboi 00:21, 2 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Can anyone add info on other cities?

I know faux queens really got a huge boost and exposure with the San Francisco Faux Queen pageants but women parodying female drag didn't start there. I know Deena Davenport and Connie Champagne are role models for many. Any other faux's out there, and any other cities have faux queen events? Benjiboi 08:48, 3 June 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Lady Gaga

We need to remove her picture from this page. She's a musician, not a female female impersonator. I spent 15 minutes googling her name and faux queen and this wikipedia was the only instance I found of the two together

FreddyPickle (talk) 19:45, 18 June 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Agreed, she's flamboyant and all but if she doesn't self=identify as a drag queen then likely she shouldn't be a part of the article. -- Banjeboi 23:45, 5 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just added archive links to 2 external links on Faux queen. Please take a moment to review my edit. If necessary, add {{cbignore}} after the link to keep me from modifying it. Alternatively, you can add {{nobots|deny=InternetArchiveBot}} to keep me off the page altogether. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, please set the checked parameter below to true to let others know.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—^{cyberbot II}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 22:02, 14 January 2016 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified (January 2018)

Hello fellow Wikipedians,

I have just modified 2 external links on Faux queen. Please take a moment to review my edit. If you have any questions, or need the bot to ignore the links, or the page altogether, please visit this simple FaQ for additional information. I made the following changes:

When you have finished reviewing my changes, you may follow the instructions on the template below to fix any issues with the URLs.

This message was posted before February 2018. After February 2018, "External links modified" talk page sections are no longer generated or monitored by InternetArchiveBot. No special action is required regarding these talk page notices, other than regular verification using the archive tool instructions below. Editors have permission to delete these "External links modified" talk page sections if they want to de-clutter talk pages, but see the RfC before doing mass systematic removals. This message is updated dynamically through the template {{source check}} (last update: 5 June 2024).

If you have discovered URLs which were erroneously considered dead by the bot, you can report them with this tool.
If you found an error with any archives or the URLs themselves, you can fix them with this tool.

Cheers.—InternetArchiveBot (Report bug) 18:00, 20 January 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Michelle Visage

http://www.newnownext.com/michelle-visage-bisexual-drag-queen-guardian/03/2020/

---Another Believer _(Talk) 19:57, 30 March 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Rename article to Female Queen

Faux queen is generally outdated and widely considered offensive. "Female queen" or "female drag queen" is more commonly seen in news articles, reference books and in use by performers. While "faux queen" needs to redirect here (as it's used in some older pageants and in historical literature), this article should be titled with a more common term.

The article had also not been updated in over a decade; I added information on the more recent news around AFAB/female queens in media and a section on discrimination within the community. --PropterScientiam (talk) 01:39, 15 July 2020 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by PropterScientiam (talk • contribs) 01:32, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Some initial searches suggest that this is not supported by the majority of sources, but I'll have to look more in detail later. Mathglot (talk)

In most of the cited articles, the terms "bioqueen," "female queen" or "cisgender female drag queen" is used. This old edit also contradicts the current article "drag queen" which also states that faux queen is considered offensive. --PropterScientiam (talk) 14:47, 15 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

This is still not addressed. Evidence for faux queen being offensive:

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2017/jul/10/workin-it-how-female-drag-queens-are-causing-a-scene

https://www.glamourmagazine.co.uk/article/female-drag-queen-real-life-story

This is a marginalized group being referred to by an outdated and widely offensive term and NEEDS to be corrected ASAP as there are currently several high profile AFAB/female queens in the news.

PropterScientiam (talk) 13:24, 20 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

"AFAB" is inappropriate and transphobic in this context

The article is full of the phrase "assigned female at birth", but that term includes trans men who are drag queens. But trans men performing as drag queens are not "faux queens", "female queens", nor "female female impersonators". They are men performing as women, i.e. male drag queens (who were also assigned female at birth - "AFAB" describes a past, not present state).

The term is completely out of place and makes the transphobic implication that trans people should be viewed as their assigned sex in drag context, which is even contradicted in the introduction itself, so I'm surprised nobody noticed yet. 2A00:1398:9:FB03:A52A:CD80:ACCA:A0F7 (talk) 13:17, 10 August 2023 (UTC)[reply]

"AFAB drag queen" is the term used by trans men, cis women and nonbinary people who perform as drag queens. It is used because all 3 groups face the same challenges and discrimination within the community on the basis of their assigned sex at birth. The only reason to distinguish a drag queen according to their out of drag gender is to discuss discrimination against their gender or representation of it within drag, and discrimination against women queens (mostly trans women) is different than discrimination against AFAB queens.

Gottmik, for example, faces the same pushback and discrimination as Victoria Scone, despite Gottmik being a trans man, while Sasha Colby, a trans woman, does not.

In discussing a group discriminated against based on assigned sex at birth, it is appropriate to reference their assigned sex. PropterScientiam (talk) 04:39, 6 December 2023 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, because drag queens like Gottmik are men who were assigned female at birth. I can look into more inclusive definitions. BeaniLibrarian (talk) 00:53, 6 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]

"born a female"

This terminology, in my opinion, is inappropriate for the context of the article. While I don't necessarily agree that the term "AFAB queen" is fully inclusive to the transgender community, I would like to make a note that some of those assigned female at birth may not necessarily resonate with "born a female." I also believe that specifying "assigned female at birth" rather than "born a female" is more consistent in regards to the title of the article. BeaniLibrarian (talk) 00:57, 6 September 2024 (UTC)[reply]