Wikipedia:Templates for deletion/Log/2008 October 19

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October 19

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the template below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the debate was delete per Wikipedia's copyright policies. Garion96 (talk) 20:16, 1 November 2008 (UTC)

Template:Free use RM

Template:Free use RM (talk · history · transclusions · logs · subpages)

This is not a valid fair use claim. ViperSnake151 21:48, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

Please tell me why do you think that the template is not valid, when to administrators had a discussion about should it be deleted or not and they still have not decided. The majority of the arguments were in favor of the template. You can see the discussion [[ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:IMAGEHELP#Image:Bulgarian_police_Macedonia_1942.JPG%7Chere]]. --Revizionist (talk) 05:45, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

Your red link attempted to reference Wikipedia:IMAGEHELP#Image:Bulgarian_police_Macedonia_1942.JPG. Read the discussion there again: Only your own comment there was in favor of the template. The other two contributers were strongly opposed to the template. I did not add my own opposition because they had put forward such strong arguments against it. The only thing I might have mentioned (other than seconding their opposition) was that the template is misnamed: It is not a free use template but a non-free use template. When the template is deleted, as it should be, the name is irrelevant. —teb728 t c 07:04, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

• delete. Several reasons: (a) we don't do country-specific fair use tags. This template clearly describes a non-free content situation, Macedonia's equivalent of "fair use". But for us, those images still have to pass US fair use (and our NFCC). Macedonian law is hardly relevant to that. (b) There's nothing in that law that even applies to most images here anyway. We are dealing neither with "works that are seen or heard during reports on daily events", nor "direct teaching", nor "humanitarian manifestations", nor "internal use by public institutions", nor any other of the cases outlined there. Macedonian law is more concrete in these matters than US law, and it does not cover us, except in the case of: "for the purpose of clarification, debate or reference, it shall be free to quote a copyright work to the extent adequate to the purpose and the aim of use" (which is of course covered by US fair use too.) Fut.Perf. ☼ 06:11, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

• Why is this license a problem?--Freewayguy 23:23, 20 October 2008 (UTC)

There are two reasons why the license is a problem: In the first place, as a matter of policy Wikipedia does not accept a license unless it allows reuse by anyone for anything including commercial use and modification. The Macedonian law behind the template is not a free license in that sense. Secondly, as Fut.Perf. explains above, the Macedonian law is so restrictive that it does not even permit most fair use on Wikipedia. So the template is of no use. —teb728 t c 07:06, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

• And Macedonia appears to use the {{PD-old-70}} rule, and there do not appear to be any other catch-22's like US law...so I have marked this for deletion as a blatant misrepresentation of established policy. Though I see legally they have an implementation of the whole "small modifications or reproductions of a PD work is still PD" rule. ViperSnake151 14:59, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

• We have the same template at the Macedonian Wikipedia. Is it invalid there, as it is here? I seriously doubt that uploading images under this template is justified, because Wikipedia only accepts images that can be redistributed, modified and used for any purpose, with the occasional fair use/no free alternative option. This template justifies the use of every image, regardless of the copyrights, for educational purposes under the Macedonian law. A bit off-topic, but related, what do you make of this template (used here)?! Brainmachine (talk) 22:26, 21 October 2008 (UTC)

Makedonian Wikipedia presumably chooses to operate under Macedomian law for copyright. And this template would be relevant there. Taemyr (talk) 06:06, 27 October 2008 (UTC)

• delete. This is a way to evade a Copyright principles. If every country in Europe is going to make such an exclusive license, and in this way the Copyfraud will be regular policy of Wikipedia. Just see below. Whole articles about RoM are full with such violating the rules images, examples:

National Liberation War of Macedonia

People's Liberation Army of Macedonia

Exodus of Ethnic Macedonians from Greece

This is absoluttely inadmissibly. Jingby (talk) 13:08, 22 October 2008 (UTC)

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the template's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this section.

Template:CT-\d+

Almost all of these can be easily replaced by CSS declarations. A few are simple enough they should just be subst'ed into the table style attribute where they are used. The few which do contain actual html tags should be moved to more descriptive titles if they are to be kept. I have no idea what the numbers mean in the names of these templates (possibly the order in which they were created). — CharlotteWebb 21:44, 19 October 2008 (UTC)

• Why is these templates similar?--Freewayguy 23:23, 20 October 2008 (UTC)
• Delete/subst, etc Really, I don't think most of these are necessary. They are not well-used, and there are too many of them for anyone to remember what they all do. This, that and the other _[talk] 09:27, 22 October 2008 (UTC)
• Comment As it happens, I'm just starting a self-project to re-do the table layout for various Unicode tables (discussion). I found this discussion when I went to look up what the templates did. The tables I'm targeting appear to be the chief (only?) things which use these templates, and when I'm done, they won't use them anymore. Hopefully that will be soon. FWIW, FYI, HAND, etc. —DragonHawk (talk|hist) 03:11, 4 November 2008 (UTC)