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Manilal Dwivedi

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I want to submit this biographical article for FA, which has been promoted to GA by me. Please help me to make it suitable for FA nomination. Thanks, Gazal world (talk) 10:14, 17 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Tim riley

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You asked for my comments and here they are:

  • Early life
  • The second paragraph – 117 words in six sentences – has just one citation. Is every statement in the paragraph covered in the cited Thakar book?
  • "completed a Bachelor of Arts in history and politics" – is a word missing? Either "completed a Bachelor of Arts degree in history and politics" or, better, I think, "graduated as a Bachelor of Arts in history and politics"
  • "James Tylor" – or James Taylor? Just checking.
  • Literary works
  • Religious and philosophical writings
  • "It addressed the science of mesmerism and presents a study of yoga" – sudden switch from past to present tense.
  • "many were particularly critical of the logical lapses and inconsistencies in Manilal's arguments." – this seems to side with the critics rather than being neutral. I think what you want is something like "many were particularly critical of what they regarded as logical lapses and inconsistencies in Manilal's arguments".
  • "Baroda State Archeology Department" – surprising use of the American spelling: one might expect the English spelling, "archaeology".
  • "which he could not attend due to financial constraints" – a bit mealy-mouthed, perhaps. In plain words, he could not afford to go.
  • Social reforms and educational writings
  • Translation
  • "Uttararamacarita was considered an excellent translation by the critic Mansukhlal Jhaveri." – citation wanted, I think.
  • "by the critic Mansukhlal Jhaveri. He also translated" – the He is Manilal, and it would be better to use his name here rather than the pronoun, which can be read as referring to the critic immediately preceding it.
  • Controversies
  • Reception
  • The second paragraph is another long one with only one citation. That's fine if the one citation justifies every statement in the paragraph: but be sure it does before going to FAC.
  • References
  • These look pretty good to my inexpert eye, but I dislike your practice of putting in an external link to Google Books for books such as Thakar's for which not even a snippet view is available. If I click on a link to a source I expect to be able to read what it says unless it is shown as a subscription site (see next bullet point). I know others disagree with me on this point, but I mention it nonetheless.
  • It is usual, and I think helpful, to use the {{subscription}} template for JSTOR sources and anything else for which a subscription is needed for access.

Those are my detailed comments. As to the article as a whole, I found it clear, in good, readable prose with a range of sources. I know absolutely nothing of the subject, but the article seemed on the short side to me for a Featured Article. We don't want padding, but are we sure the present text covers all that needs to be covered? Fine if so. I wish you luck at FAC. – Tim riley talk 07:17, 7 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

@Tim riley: Hello. once again thank you for your suggestions. I have added some important details into article, and added three new paragraph in 'Religious and philosophical writings' section (first three paragraph). --Gazal world (talk) 17:56, 11 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments from Gog the Mild

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I have copy edited a little. Let me know if I have messed anything up.

  • "to a Sathodara Nagar family". Suggestion only → 'to a Sathodara Nagar (high caste) family'.
  • "at the Oriental Congress". When was this held? Where was it held? Did Manilal attend in person?
  • "and the Bhagavad Gita with commentary". This is a little unclear. Do you mean 'and he translated the Bhagavad Gita into Gujarati with a commentary'?
  • "in the Samaldas College here (Bhavnagar)" If you have added Bhavnagar, it should be in square brackets.

I am not familiar with literature articles at FA, nor very familiar with biographies; for what it is worth, this looks FACable to me. I would however agree with Tim that it seems a little thin. Don't add padding, but if there is any missing germane information, feel free to add it. Gog the Mild (talk) 19:41, 8 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

PS Parel and Raval should include the page ranges of the chapters cited. Gog the Mild (talk) 19:47, 8 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Hello Gog the Mild Thanks for your comments. I have addressed all the issues suggested by you except one (the Bhagavad Gita). As you and Tim found the article a little thin, I have added three paragraphs in 'Religious and philosophical writings' section. --Gazal world (talk) 14:41, 11 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Comments by PM

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G'day Gazal world! As promised, I've had a read and have a few comments, which I make with the understanding that whilst I know my way around a FA bio, I haven't much experience reviewing bio articles on cultural figures like this fellow, so my expectations may not be in line with consensus:

  • you probably don't need to duplicate his date of death in the lead, just say "died at the age of 40"
  • suggest BA→Bachelor of Arts in the infobox and link
  • is there a useful link to an article describing the Indian education system of the time? For example, what are the second, third and fourth standards?
  • was he admitted to the MA degree or was this informal outside the education system?
@Peacemaker67: And this ? --Gazal world (talk) 11:38, 12 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
I’m not sure the MA should be mentioned if he wasn’t admitted into the degree. Perhaps just say that after his BA he continued his studies at home. Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 12:37, 12 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]
  • The Early life section is really his whole life, perhaps the Personal life section could be combined with this one and titled Biography. This could be followed by the Works section, Controversies and Reception, although the latter two could arguably be flipped
  • link subjects at first mention in the body as well as in the lead, such as Pandit Yuga, Gujarati language, Advaita Vedanta (move to first mention),
  • Dhirubhai Thaker is duplicate linked, just use his family name after introducing him
  • I don't think Advaita Vedanta, karma yoga and Swa-Sudharak should be italicised, as they are not literary works
  • drop the comma from "December, 1886"
  • which he edited from 1885 until his death in 1898, as if you have combined the two "Life" sections into one, you will have already said when he died
  • just use Mansukhlal Jhaveri's family name after introducing him, same with Ramanbhai Neelkanth and anyone else whose name appears more than once in the body (see MOS:SURNAME)
  • move the Ggovernment
  • Gujarati theatre, yoga, Brahman, Kevalādvaita and mesmerism are all duplicate linked

I haven't looked at the image licensing or sources. Nice job thus far! Peacemaker67 (click to talk to me) 08:55, 12 July 2020 (UTC)[reply]

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