User talk:DJ Cane

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• 2022-2023

Editor experience invitation

Hi DJ Cane :) I'm looking for people to interview here. Feel free to pass if you're not interested. Clovermoss🍀 (talk) 21:31, 24 February 2024 (UTC)

I've added my experience. That's for this project, it's fun to read through other replies and I think it's a great way to prepare experienced editors to have more patience with new folks. DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 21:48, 24 February 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for participating. You might find it interesting that I also started contributing as a teenager (just a bit past my 16th birthday). I don't reflect on my earliest edits quite the same way as you do, but it's interesting to learn about your experience. Clovermoss🍀 (talk) 08:55, 25 February 2024 (UTC)

Admin help

My talk page was recently vandalized by User:Rocketman771 (diff) after they had a contrary opinion to mine in a discussion at Talk:Tornadoes of 2024/Archive 1#New Model for main tornado article: 2024 suggested changes and improvements. In that discussion, the same user was bordering on personal attacks based on perceived national identity. I'm not sure what sort of action is appropriate in this situation, but this seemed like a more appropriate method than WP:ANI since this appears to be their first issue like this. Thanks! DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 16:41, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

Shortly after posting this notice, I experienced similar vandalism (diff) from User:Yellowboy7. Seems like possible sock puppetry but an admin will be more equipped to handle the situation. DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 16:49, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

If you wish to report Rocketman, take this to WP:ANI. If you wish to allege socking, take this to WP:SPI.--Bbb23 (talk) 17:58, 3 March 2024 (UTC)

Oof

Maybe I should remove my question? Sorry for going off topic. MidnightStudios16 (talk) 23:59, 13 March 2024 (UTC)

I don't think you need to remove it, it's a fine question and we have shown that we are moving over to a more appropriate location. As a general rule, don't delete messages from talk pages. You could strike it out or apologize if you really think you need to, but I don't think either are necessary in this instance. DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 00:09, 14 March 2024 (UTC)

Thank you

for catching this. The source seems to be written in a confusing way as it states "Within a 13-mile radius of Kelly Butte (Plate 1) there are over 32 volcanic vents; within c 20-mile radius centered at Troutdale there are 90 volcanic centers. Most of these were originally small cinder cones like Pilot Butte and Lava Butte near Bend, Oregon [...]," but I think maybe they only meant to say that there are many vents close to Portland and that they resemble Pilot Butte in size/volcano type. Either way I appreciate you catching and correcting my error. ceranthor 23:53, 1 May 2024 (UTC)

Happy to help! That's what open source collaboration is about. DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 17:24, 3 May 2024 (UTC)

All about Chehalis floods, I am...

Hey DJ Cane!

Massive fan of your work and you're a decent photographer to boot! I want to start by saying thank you so very much for your expertise in helping the Flood history in Chehalis, Washington article become better and for your kind words I noticed (thanks to the pings!) about the article at the weather-related WikiProject.

I'm about a couple days from being done, fleshing out details using local sourcing to give a more boots-on-the-ground perspective that is often lost by regional or national news. I have a sentence or two left for the 2007 event and I'll be expanding on the 2009 flood after and then, that's it! I'm hoping I can reach out to you once I'm done and see if you'd be awesome enough to help copyedit or do a final run-through read of the page? I ask because weather stuff seems more your lane and you're a proven good editor.

Again, thanks for everything and I'll reach out in a day or two. In the meantime, happy editing!

Shortiefourten (talk) 19:16, 25 June 2024 (UTC)

Hi @Shortiefourten!

Thanks for reaching out. I'm glad you appreciate my work and that you saw the pings. I think Flood history in Chehalis, Washington is awesome and the work you've undertaken is very thorough. Having lived (kind of) nearby for most of my life I know this is a major component of the goings on in the Chehalis area.

I am very happy to copyedit, apply my meteorological knowledge to the page (if needed), and discuss it more once you're finished. I have it added to my watched pages list. I am busy for the next few weeks but let me know when you feel finished and I'll take a deep look. Until then maybe I'll try to find some additional photos from Commons to work in.

After it reaches a good spot, I recommend nominating it for Good Article status under WP:GAN#WEATHER. I think the major thing lacking to reach that threshold right now is a lack of pictures. We might be able to remedy this with content from Commons, but it may also be that historical images and public domain maps need to be uploaded (something I don't have experience with).

If you are in the Chehalis area, consider running out to take and upload some pictures of the levee around the airport, some of the flood-related infrastructure on Dillenbaugh Creek, a visible high water mark on a bridge or building, and/or some freshly logged areas upstream. If there's some sort of memorial plaque somewhere a picture of it would be a good addition too. Unfortunately I do not live close enough to Chehalis to contribute to this phase of the project.

DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 19:54, 25 June 2024 (UTC)

Hey DJ Cane!

First...thank you so damn much for the weather box at Chehalis, Washington. I've been desiring to see one on the page for who-knows-how-long. Even had a sandbox chart I kept putting off. Really...thanks, dude! Not my strength at all...

I'm all done, as far as I can tell, at the Flood history in Chehalis, Washington page. I know you're busy, but when you do have a moment, I know your expertise and talents for weather-related articles will be of great value. Add, subtract, question the work...no offense will be taken! Reach out if you are conflicted or unsure about any of it.

As for photos, I tried finding some U.S. guvmint pics but to little avail. Copyright scares the Taco Bell out of me but I'll keep looking. I've visited Chehalis enough to see that there isn't any plaque or sign commemorating a flood, and the community tends to clean up after themselves pretty thoroughly, so haven't seen any high-water markings either. But next time down there, I'll take another look. Commons is barren with photos specific to Chehalis flooding, but I'll keep trying to find something there. As for infrastructure, I have a few. Just need to find 'em on this laptop thing in front of me. My husband will be thrilled I need to go visit my favorite small city in Washington again, just like I am when I'm dragged to a Mariners game.

Thanks for your compliments and let me know if you need any clarification on the flood page. But please, no rush, no need for you to drop everything else!

Shortiefourten (talk) 19:26, 26 June 2024 (UTC)

Good afternoon Shortiefourten,

I started doing a thorough review of it today! I'll probably work slowly and mostly section by section. In most instances I'll make edits directly within the article but if I feel there's something to discuss I'll make sure to ask. Overall, though, this is a really good article! I think it may be unique among Wikipedia articles about localized flooding with how thorough but also well written it is.

Happy to help with the Chehalis infobox! It's a real bummer that there isn't a long-term climate site there but I like OSU PRISM a lot and think it is reasonably accurate. I noticed with your edit ping that you were using WeatherSpark in the sandbox. WeatherSpark is good too, though I slightly favor OSU within the United States. In either case, a reliable source is a reliable source and is valid for use.

I'm curious to know why Chehalis is your favorite city in Washington! I've driven through several times (and will again tomorrow evening), but have never stopped to actually do anything there. I did eat at the Applebees in Centralia last year, though.

Cheers!

DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 21:57, 26 June 2024 (UTC)

Hey DJ Cane!

I see you're only up to the 1950s...my writing gets worse! I agree with the changes and a real "duh!" moment from shifting the flood stage levels from the lede to Flood causes section. I just fixed the 'by whom' template concerns. Should've known better...reach out if any major concerns but it's looking better.

As for the weather table at my sandbox, it was just a copy-paste, borrowed from here-and-there...I hadn't done any actual work on it yet as some editors really don't like weather boxes unless there's some weather station in that town. Also, just because I can check the weather and bad-mouth a weather reporter like a drunk longshoreman does not a weather expert makes me. Again, total thanks!

Why is Chehalis my fave? It just speaks to me, to be goofily introspective. Back when I was a teen, let's say Clinton years, and rural western WA was struggling after the timber industry dried up, I noticed so many city folk bad-mouthing rural spots - "don't go there" - type of stuff. And when I received my license and went driving, I didn't see what the fear was. Chehalis struggled and rebuilt. There's a pride and quietness that I find satisfying. Not touristy like most small cities/towns, and there's real blue-collar/white-collar people going about their days, enjoying this little community. Sure, most would want to visit the beach (cold and seafood stink!), a lake (screaming kids and beer cans!), or the mountains (crowded and touristy!), but no, I pick Chehalis.

Born, raised, and worked my entire life in Olympia. No family in Chehalis, no connection, no ownership of property. Like you probably have, I just enjoy a spot because it hits!

As if reading thru an entire flood article isn't enough of my typing for you!

Again, thanks for the overview. If you ever are in the mood to stop in the Twin Cities, and food is on your mind, everyone down there will tell you to try Berry Fields Cafe - order the cinnamon roll - doctor or high blood sugar be damned. Lunch? You gotta go to Once Upon a Thyme in Chehalis, and then dinner at Jeremy's, too.

But Applebee's...? I had so much respect for you...!

Shortiefourten (talk) 19:04, 27 June 2024 (UTC)

The proofreading project is  Done! It's a great article overall. I added one more tag in my editing this morning for you to review. Make sure to scan it to make sure no other tags were missed. I think your next step should be submitting it for GA review. They may be picky and ask for more photos (which we discussed before). If they do, it may be worth just adding non-flood pictures of some of the locations discussed (airport, mall, I-5, levees, pumps etc.) or taking pictures of these spots yourself to add to the article. Let me know if I can help further! DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 16:12, 19 July 2024 (UTC)

Hey DJ Cane!

I can only thank you so many times before I think an admin might come along and think we're in cahoots or something! Your work on the article made it graduate to a possible GA...without your input, meh...! Not sure I'm comfortable nominating my own work but one day I'll get around to adding some locales and flood pics to the page.

I believe I fixed all the tag issues so I believe I am also  Done, until the next flood anyway. I'll keep in mind from now on that it's preferrable to convert from inches to mm when dealing with precipitation. You weather guys, always trying to be exact!

Not sure when we'll run into each other again, but until then, happy editing and know that from here on out, you're one of the best editors out there, no doubt, in my opinion and experience! You didn't have to put in the effort or be as helpful as you were and I'll never forget that. You are an example of what a Wikipedia should strive to be.

Thanks one last time!

Shortiefourten (talk) 18:03, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

Hi Shortiefourten,

I think you definitely should nominate your own work for GA! As far as I've seen, it's customary for the primary editor(s) of the article to do so which in this case would definitely be you.

Note that we typically use mm for rain but cm for snow. The mm values seem unwieldy in this case because of the amount of rain causing these floods, but that's the standard.

Looking forward to crossing paths again! Thanks for the kind words! DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 18:08, 23 July 2024 (UTC)

A Teamwork Barnstar!

		The Teamwork Barnstar
		For all your help in making my efforts at the Flood history in Chehalis, Washington article, and our mutual Wiki-interests, better! Shortiefourten (talk) 19:34, 26 June 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 21:14, 26 June 2024 (UTC)

List of F5 and EF5 tornadoes Improvement Time!

Hello there! I am sending this alert to all members of the WikiProject Weather and editors who have recently edited in the realm of tornadoes.

There is a large and important discussion ongoing, with the goal to completely overhaul and improve the List of F5 and EF5 tornadoes. The previous improvement attempt back in 2022/2023 gained almost no participation. This alert is being sent out so these discussions hopefully gain a reasonably-sized participation, so the F5/EF5 tornado article, one of the most viewed weather-related articles on Wikipedia, can be improved for all readers!

If you wish to participate, please visit: Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Weather/Possible F5/EF5/IF5 tornadoes. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 21:42, 17 July 2024 (UTC)

Alert: PD-NWS Violations

This is an alert being sent to all active editors on the WikiProject of Weather and any editor who has recently editors weather-related articles.

Editors on the Commons have received communication from the National Weather Service that the Template:PD-NWS, which is often used to upload weather-related images, is incorrect. There will be a discussion starting on the Commons Copyright Noticeboard within the next few days to determine how to manage this issue. Under the current PD-NWS copyright template, images on any NWS webpage was considered to be in the public domain unless it had a direct copyright symbol and/or copyright watermark.

One National Weather Service office has confirmed this is not the case. For the next few days, it may be best to not upload any image from an NWS webpage that was not made or taken directly by the National Weather Service themselves. Once the Commons determine how to move forward, editors will recent a new alert. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 23:41, 1 August 2024 (UTC)

PD-NWS Violations Update #1

I am providing members of the WikiProject of Weather along with users who frequently edit weather-related articles an update to the discussions regarding the PD-NWS image copyright template.

For starters, no "formal" administrative-style rules have occurred. All that means is the template is not formally deprecated and is still in use. However, Rlandmann, an administrator on English Wikipedia, has begun an undertaking of reviewing and assessing all images (~1,400) that use the PD-NWS copyright template.

What we know:

• Following email communications, the National Weather Service of Sioux Falls has removed their disclaimer, which has been used for the PD-NWS template for decades. This means, as far as the National Weather Service is concerned, the following statement is no longer valid: By submitting images, you understand that your image is being released into the public domain. This means that your photo or video may be downloaded, copied, and used by others. Currently, the PD-NWS template links to an archived version of the disclaimer. However, the live version of the disclaimer no longer contains that phrase.
• See this deletion discussion for this point's information. NWS Paducah (1) failed to give attribution to a photographer of a tornado photograph, (2) placed the photo into the public domain without the photographer explicitly giving them permission to do so (i.e. the photo is not actually in the public domain), (3) and told users to acknowledge NWS as the source for information on the webpage. Oh, to note, this photographer is a magistrate (i.e. a judge). So, the idea of automatically trusting images without clear attribution on weather.gov are free-to-use is in question.
• The Wikimedia Commons has a process known as precautionary principle, where if their is significant doubt that an image is free-to-use, it will be deleted. Note, one PD-NWS file has been deleted under the precautionary principle. The closing administrator remarks for the deletion discussion were: "Per the precautionary principle, there is "significant doubt" about the public domain status of this file (4x keep + nominator, 5x delete), so I will delete it."
• Several photographs/images using the PD-NWS are currently mid-deletion discussion, all for various reasonings.
• As of this message, 250 PD-NWS images have been checked out of the ~1,400.
• The photograph of the 1974 Xenia tornado (File:Xenia tornado.jpg) was found to not be in the public domain. It is still free-to-use, but under a CC 2.0 license, which requires attribution. From April 2009 to August 2024, Wikipedia/Wikimedia was incorrectly (and by definition, illegally) using the photograph, as it was marked incorrectly as a public domain photograph.

Solutions:
As stated earlier, there is no "formal" rulings, so no "formal" changes have been made. However, there is a general consensus between editors on things which are safe to do:

• Images made directly by NWS employees can be uploaded and used under the new PD-USGov-NWS-employee template (Usage: {{PD-USGov-NWS-employee}} ). This is what a large number of PD-NWS templated images are being switched to.
• Images from the NOAA Damage Assessment Toolkit (DAT) can be uploaded and used under the PD-DAT template (Usage: {{PD-DAT}} ). A large number of images are also being switched to this template.

For now, you are still welcome to upload images under the PD-NWS template. However, if possible it is recommended using the two templates above. I will send out another update when new information is found or new "rulings" have been made. The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 03:28, 17 August 2024 (UTC)

What a cluster. Thanks for the update. DJ Cane _(he/him) (Talk) 16:42, 19 August 2024 (UTC)

PD-NWS Violations Update #2 (Key To Read Third Section)

I am providing members of the WikiProject of Weather along with users who frequently edit weather-related articles an new update (2nd update) to the discussions regarding the PD-NWS image copyright template.

On the Commons, an RFC discussion is taking place to figure out how to manage the template. No "formal" administrative-style rules have occurred, so nothing has changed. That is not a surprise as the RFC is still ongoing.

What is new?

• The entire Template:PD-NWS has been placed inside a "License Review" template, which is viewable via the link aforementioned.
• Most of the photographs which were uploaded to the Commons originally under the PD-NWS template (approximately 1,500) have been reviewed. Out of those ~1,500 images, only about 150 are requiring additional looks. Most images have been verified as free-to-use and switched to a respective, valid template.
• As of this moment, approximately 50 photos have been nominated for deletion (results pending).
• A handful of images have been deleted (either confirmed copyrighted or under the Commons precautionary principle.
• One image has been kept following a deletion request under the PD-NWS template.

How to deal with new photos?

Given all of this, you might be wondering how the heck you use weather photos while creating articles? Well, here is what you can do!

• If the photo was made by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (excluding NWS), You can upload it under the PD-NOAA template via {{PD-NOAA}}.
• If the photo was made by the National Weather Service (NOT Third Party), you can upload it using the new PD-NWS-employee template via {{PD-USGov-NWS-employee}}.
  • If the photo originates on the Damage Assessment Toolkit, you can upload it using the PD-DAT template via {{PD-DAT}}.
• If the photo is from a U.S. NEXRAD radar, you can upload it using the PD-NEXRAD template via via {{PD-NEXRAD}}.

What about third-party photos?

In the case of third-party photos...i.e. ones not taken by the National Weather Service themselves...there is an option which was discussed and confirmed to be valid from an English Wikipedia Administrator.

• KEY: Third party images of tornadoes & weather-related content can potentially be uploaded via Wikipedia's Non-Free Content Guidelines!
• Experiments/testing has been done already! In fact, I bet you couldn't tell the difference, but the tornado photograph used at the top of the 2011 Joplin tornado was already switched to a Non-Free File (NFF)! Check it out: File:Photograph of the 2011 Joplin tornado.jpeg! That photo's description can also be used as a template for future third-party tornado photographs uploaded to Wikipedia...with their respective information replaced.
• NFFs can be uploaded to multiple articles as well!
• The absolute key aspect of NFFs is that they relate to the article and are not decoration. For example with the Joplin tornado, the photograph: (1) shows the size of the tornado, (2) shows the "wall of darkness", which was described by witnesses, (3) shows a historic, non-repeatable event of the deadliest tornado in modern U.S. history. The exact reasoning does not have to be extremely specific as Wikipedia's NFF guidelines "is one of the most generous in the world" (words of Rlandmann (not pinged), the administrator reviewing all the PD-NWS template images).
• Tornado photographs will almost certainly qualify under the NFF guidelines, especially for tornadoes with standalone articles or standalone sections.
• NFFs cannot be used when a free-photograph is available, no matter the quality, unless the section is about that specific photograph. For example, the photograph used at the top of the 2013 Moore tornado article is confirmed to be free-to-use, therefore, no NFFs of that tornado can be uploaded on Wikipedia. However, the "Dead Man Walking" photograph could almost certainly be uploaded as an NFF to the 1997 Jarrell tornado article as that photograph is the topic of a section in the article.
• NFFs currently on Wikipedia can and should be placed in this category: Category:Non-free pictures of tornadoes.

Update Closing

Hopefully all of that information kept you informed on the Commons copyright discussion process and how you can still create the best articles possible! If you have a question about something mentioned above, reply back and I will do my best to answer it! Also, ping me in the process to ensure I see it! Have a good day! The Weather Event Writer (Talk Page) 01:00, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

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