Template talk:Certification Table Entry

South Africa (RiSA)

As of 1 January 2024, the Recording Industry of South Africa had their certification levels changed. I was planning to tabulate the change in streams and units but I figured this would be enough. (special ping: Muhandes) dxneo (talk) 20:35, 28 August 2024 (UTC)

@Dxneo: The first thing to do would be to update the article. As for the template, I'm not sure what to do with this. Say an album/single was released on June 2023 and certified on March 2024. Most sales are still before January 2024 so they follow the old sales figure, but some follow the new figure. The only sure fact is that albums/singles released from 2024 are following the new figures. What do you think? Muhandes (talk) 07:04, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

I honestly don't know. It would've been easier if they updated all recordings do this new figure (maybe they did and we don't know). I was thinking South Africa2, then we will try to update recent use South Africa looking the certification date and since there's not that much South African music on this site it won't take that long. Then maybe put a notice on both templates to alarm editors to check the dates before proceeding ( proceed with caution). I don't know if I make any sense at all, but what's your suggestion? dxneo (talk) 12:16, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

And another thing that has been bothering me for years is why United States and most other identifiers like United Kingdom, their template URL lead directly to the specified certification but South Africa doesn't. I mean why isn't it like this ? dxneo (talk) 12:23, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Dxneo: This was never done because no one suggested it. I will look into it. One thing I am not looking into is verifying the 182+ articles using this citation, see Category:Certification Table Entry usages for South Africa (195). Follow up on Template talk:Cite certification, where this suggestion belongs. Muhandes (talk) 12:45, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Dxneo: Actually, no follow-up needed—I just went ahead and quickly implemented it. Wadayanow, after 44 years of writing code, it worked on the first try, at least from the few checks I made. Let me know if you find any problems.  Done on this one. --Muhandes (talk) 17:59, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Great, it's working just fine. Thank you. dxneo (talk) 18:38, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

Dxneo, I just realized that I already implemented this change in June. It seems like I didn't notice the discrepancy I mentioned above and I simply went by |certyear=. On retrospect, I suggest we correct the sales figure to follow |relyear=. For example, Come Closer (Wizkid song) was certified 4× Platinum in June 2024. However, as the album was released in 2017, most sales are probably before 2024. All we can say for sure is that at least 80,000 units were sold, so this is what we should list, instead of 160,000. Muhandes (talk) 12:36, 29 August 2024 (UTC)

@Dxneo: What do you think? Muhandes (talk) 10:06, 5 September 2024 (UTC)

Hello Muhandes, sorry for replying so late. I honestly don't know how to move about this. However, what I know is that the sales figures have to be updated to keep the encyclopedia up to date. I honestly think that RiSA took this into consideration before implementing this big change. What I mean is that I think they have updated the units on each and every recording on the website. Problem is that unlike RIAA, RiSA doesn't display units. Thoughts? dxneo (talk) 01:43, 7 October 2024 (UTC)

Nigeria

Hello Muhandes, sorry for directly pinging, but you are usually the only one who helps with this kind of things. I think I finally found TurnTable Certification System of Nigeria's certification level (here). Let me know what you think. dxneo (talk) 09:53, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

@Dxneo: I don't see a reason why it cannot be added. I suppose the certifications are on the tab which says "Display", not the one which says "Eligible Songs", am I correct? Muhandes (talk) 12:22, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

Yes sir, you are correct. dxneo (talk) 12:32, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

Not sure why they made "eligible songs" and "display" since they both literally show the same thing. dxneo (talk) 12:36, 23 October 2024 (UTC)

@Dxneo: Indeed, a mystery. You will also notice certifications from 2025, so this seems a little amateurish. Nevertheless, no one objected to this request or the article, so I added |region=Nigeria as an option.  Done Muhandes (talk) 19:40, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

I just tested it on "Baddest Boy", and it works fine, but I had to use |salesamount= for units. dxneo (talk) 20:08, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

@Dxneo: You used |type=song instead of |type=single and |award=platinum instead of |award=Platinum. You also made a mistake at the bottom, |streamsonly=true instead of |streaming=true. Muhandes (talk) 20:14, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you. Just that I looked for the parameters on the template and I didn't find any. You the best. dxneo (talk) 20:31, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

New Zealand changes

There are links to the new site which is Aotearoa Music Charts regarding charts and singles instead of NZ Music Charts for certifications. https://aotearoamusiccharts.co.nz/charts/singles; https://aotearoamusiccharts.co.nz/charts/albums (Example: https://aotearoamusiccharts.co.nz/archive/singles/2024-11-01; https://aotearoamusiccharts.co.nz/archive/albums/2024-11-01FireDragonValo (talk) 20:24, 1 November 2024 (UTC)

Indeed, all the citations we have are not working. In many cases an archived version is available, so we could use a bot going after them if I add support for |archive-url= and |archive-date=, but the Wayback Machine is having difficulties right now. We can support the new website by either introducing a new parameter (|chart-id=?) or introducing a new value for |source=. Pinging Ss112 who uses this often, and of course, welcoming any input. Muhandes (talk) 16:37, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

Actually, this discussion belongs in Template talk:Cite certification, but since we started here I'll continue here. I quickly implemented one solution, which you can see in the sandbox version and testcases. Basically it adds the following:

• If |source= is not specified (or |source=oldchart), |archive-url= and |archive-date= can be specified to use Wayback Machine. For example: {{Cite certification/sandbox|region=New Zealand|type=album|id=3467|archive-url=https://web.archive.org/web/20240713231341/https://nztop40.co.nz/chart/albums?chart=3467|archive-date=2024-07-13}} creates "New Zealand album certifications". Recorded Music NZ. Archived from the original on 2024-07-13.. Supposedly a bot can be used to populate these fields.
• If |source= is not specified (or |source=oldchart) and |archive-url=/|archive-date= are not specified (which is where all older citations will end), the result is a warning message and the page is categorized for bot or human correction. For example: {{Cite certification/sandbox|region=New Zealand|type=album|id=3467}} creates "New Zealand album certifications". Recorded Music NZ.. Note that, conveniently, if you edit and preview this page, you get a link to this page which lets you see which archive is available.
• If |source=newchart, |id= can be specified in date format to reach the new charts. For example: {{Cite certification/sandbox|region=New Zealand|source=newchart|type=album|id=1991-08-11}} creates "New Zealand album certifications". Recorded Music NZ.

Let me know what you think. --Muhandes (talk) 18:38, 2 November 2024 (UTC)

There are also links to their New Zealand singles and albums. Let me know what you think? (Examples: https://aotearoamusiccharts.co.nz/charts/catalogue-singles; https://aotearoamusiccharts.co.nz/charts/catalogue-albums) FireDragonValo (talk) 20:32, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

@FireDragonValo: if you are planning to use the catalogue chart extensively, we can add it as |source=catalogchart, but this is something to do after we fix all the rest. I am still looking for input about that. Muhandes (talk) 21:34, 5 November 2024 (UTC)

Great. Thank you. FireDragonValo (talk) 19:29, 6 November 2024 (UTC)

Since no one bothered to comment on this, and I am naive enough to think over 3,500 dead links (Category:Cite certification used for New Zealand with missing archive (0)) bother someone, I went ahead and made the changes above. Pinging FireDragonValo and Ss112 FWIW. I will seek bot assistance in automatically fixing these citations.

Let me know if there any problems. Otherwise, this is  Done. Muhandes (talk) 13:39, 14 November 2024 (UTC)

@Muhandes Could you add support for |archive-url=/|archive-date= for the new website as well? For example: "Espresso" has an archived link to the new website, but the live link is rendered as https://nztop40.co.nz/chart/singles?chart=2024-11-22 since |source=newchart is not specified, which leads to the wrong chart archive. It might even be preferrable to make |archive-url=/|archive-date= required for the new website as currently certifications seem to get reverted to the previous one once a new chart is published (https://aotearoamusiccharts.co.nz/archive/singles/2024-11-22 now shows "Espresso" with a double platinum certification rather than triple platinum like the archived link and the current chart). ThedancingMOONpolice (talk) 03:30, 30 November 2024 (UTC)

@ThedancingMOONpolice: I still hope these are growing pains and the website will stop doing that. Did you try communicating with the Official Aotearoa Music Charts and asking them why they do that? Muhandes (talk) 15:47, 30 November 2024 (UTC)

I have reached out to them about this matter through their contact email, but didn't receive a response. ThedancingMOONpolice (talk) 21:44, 7 December 2024 (UTC)

PMB certifications levels

Moved from User talk:Muhandes § PMB certifications levels

 – Muhandes (talk) 13:01, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

Hi, I hope you're doing well. Could you please clarify whether the PMB applies its new/recent certification levels to all titles, regardless of their release dates, or are they still based on the release year? TheWikiholic (talk) 14:05, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

@TheWikiholic PMB (Brazil) uses release date. If it was done this way, I assume there were reliable sources that said so. The sources we used are listed here. If you think the sources were misunderstood or you have contradicting evidence, start discussion at Template talk:Certification Table Entry. Muhandes (talk) 14:15, 2 December 2024 (UTC)

I contacted PMB to inquire about their certification process, specifically whether sales prior to 1990 are included. They replied:

"A Pro-Música Brasil anteriormente se chamava ABPD - Associação Brasileira dos Produtores de Discos, e foi fundada em 1958."

"As vendas são contabilizadas desde o lançamento do produto."

"Sim, por exemplo, recentemente houve a certificação deste álbum do artista Roberto Carlos, que foi lançado em 1967."

But Roberto Carlos' 1981 self-titled album is certified 12× Diamond, implying sales of 12 million units based on its release year. Do you think it's possible for an album to sell 12 million units in Brazil?. — TheWikiholic (talk) 05:45, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

I don't know. The response only says that it includes sales from the release date, it says nothing about the amount certified. What do the other sources say? With your permission, can this discussion be moved to the correct place? I doubt anyone who cares will see it on my talk page. Muhandes (talk) 07:52, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

"Ok, let's move the discussion to the appropriate place. Maybe other editors can shed some light on it." TheWikiholic (talk) 13:00, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

@Markus WikiEditor: As they are knowledgeable about the Brazilian music market. Erick (talk) 18:54, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

I have the same question. I considered several possibilities, including whether this album has a Spanish version and if sales from other countries are being included, as they do in South Korea, but I eventually ruled that out. In Roberto Carlos's discography article, there was a link stating that the album had sold 2 million copies by 1981. I reached out to Pro-Música Brasil via Instagram and Twitter to ask about it, but unfortunately, they never respond to me. Markus WikiEditor (talk) 19:07, 3 December 2024 (UTC)

I have asked two more questions to the PMB.

"Desculpe incomodar. Você pode esclarecer se aplica seus novos/recentes níveis de certificação a todos os títulos, independentemente das datas de lançamento, ou se ainda é baseado no ano de lançamento?"

"E de acordo com o banco de dados da Pro-Música Brasil, Roberto Carlos (1981) foi certificado 12 vezes Diamante. Isso equivale a 12 milhões de unidades?"

They gave me two screenshots of the current certification levels for both singles and albums and wrote that S"treams de áudio equivalentes Diamante 1x = 600.000.000, Diamante 12x = 600.000.000 x 12 = 7.200.000.000."

Isn't it clear now that they are applying certification levels based on the certification date?— TheWikiholic (talk) 00:05, 8 December 2024 (UTC)