Talk:Dong Ding tea

Tung-ting / Dong Ding

Is Dong Ding the same as Tung Ting? I got some Tung Ting Jade Oolong at Teavana. I am not familiar with Asian languages, but it sound to me like Dong Ding could be westernized/phoeneticized either way. Should this be added to the Other Names on the infobox? squirrelist 15:59, 29 September 2005 (UTC)

There is no real phonetic difference, you might aswell add it aslong as you can find a viable reference to back it up. --Iateasquirrel 21:13, 29 September 2005 (UTC)

Copyright

There is a very possible copyright violation with [1] one paragraph seems to have been copied out in full in the last edit. I am tagging the page, due to the "Copyright © 2005 TeaFromTaiwan.com All Rights Reserved" at the bottom. --Iateasquirrel 00:29, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

Sorry about that copyright thing - I am the owner of the website - what can I do to allow the material to be used here?--Taiwan Tea Man 13:52, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

These things happen. Dont worry.The general idea is that you have to releave it under the GFDL or Public Domain. Here is what Wikipedia:Copyright_problems says

Note: In general, copyright exists automatically, upon publication: an author does not need to apply for or even claim copyright for a copyright to exist. Only an explicit statement that the material is public domain or available under the GFDL makes material useable, unless it is inherently free of copyright due to its age or source.

I think you should also write here Wikipedia:Copyright_problems#October_2005 so that in general people can give you a little more advice, you'll find it somewhere deep in the Wikipedia pages. --Iateasquirrel 17:45, 20 October 2005 (UTC)

After looking over the copyright copyleft PD GNU material I think the most logical thing for me to do here is to simply re-write the material so that it can be included here. I will withdraw the material I posted here originally (can I do that now?) and re-post an edited version. I hope this is satisfactory... --211.74.95.61 07:41, 21 October 2005 (UTC)--Taiwan Tea Man 07:44, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

So now I'm confused...it seems that I can grant permission to use this material as it is. How do I do that? --Taiwan Tea Man 08:03, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

I am not too sure; basically you can either rewrite it or you can release the material on your site using GFDL, I am not sure how this is all done; probably a note where it says copyright on your site has to be replaced with whatever the GFDL requires. Dont quote me on this though, I am not sure. --Iateasquirrel 15:14, 21 October 2005 (UTC)

Edit • 16 July, 2007

I cleaned up some grammar and wikification issues, but I'd like some expansion on this topic if anyone knows anything about it. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.5.198.19 (talk) 00:19 & :21, 17 July 2007

   The second edit by the IP editor was to add the date to the heading.
--Jerzy•t 02:49, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

Name of the page

Should the name of the page be Dong Ding or Tung-ting? Most of the teas that I've seen spell it Tung-ting (the old wade spelling). S-1-5-7 (talk) 17:22, 3 August 2010 (UTC)

Redirect from Tung-ting tea

Please note: The first (and so far only) contrib to this section besides this note was made when "here" referred to the article or talk page for Dong Ding, rather than those for Tung-ting tea.--Jerzy•t 07:23, 19 January 2016 (UTC)

I've redirected Tung-ting tea to here. After lots of research, it seems ridiculous to title the article tung-ting tea. The pinyin is not correct, and the standardization of the tea industry includes having proper pinyin. Most of the teas names on Wikipedia are not correct, but we can begin to correct them soon. Similarly, Dong Ding should be displayed as two separate words. For reference: http://www.purpleculture.net/chinese-pinyin-converter/ http://www.pin1yin1.com/#凍頂%0A Waliy Sherpa 22:51, 6 January 2016 (UTC)

Redirect to Dong Ding

I've redirected this page to Dong Ding. After lots of research, it seems ridiculous to title the article tung-ting tea. The pinyin is not correct, and the standardization of the tea industry includes having proper pinyin. Most of the teas names on Wikipedia are not correct, but we can begin to correct them soon. Similarly, Dong Ding should be displayed as two separate words. For reference: http://www.purpleculture.net/chinese-pinyin-converter/ http://www.pin1yin1.com/#凍頂%0A
Waliy Sherpa 22:51, 6 January 2016 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Waliy sherpa (talk) 22:54, 6 January 2016‎

   Your obviously well-intended attempt to "redirect" produced a mess. Apparently what you wanted was renaming of the article, which done properly will both preserve the history, and provide an acceptable redirect page. Your attempt being quite recent, and undiscussed, i am cleaning up by history-merging the two pages and hereby initiating discussion of what the title should be.
   What you refer to as "the standardization of the tea industry" may, or not, be relevant to WP naming standards, and IMO your sudden pronouncement after so many other editors have contributed without putting as much urgency as you have -- obviously without understanding the potential damage of letting your edit stand -- is good reason for me to counsel you to await a consensus for a rename before further attempting to single-handedly effect a improvement.
--Jerzy•t 05:58, 19 January 2016 (UTC)

   Pursuant to that, i've converted Dong Ding and its talk page to Rdrs to the accompanying article and this talk page, and merged the content and histories of the two talk pages.
--Jerzy•t 07:23, 19 January 2016 (UTC)

Hey, Jerzy I appreciate you helping to clean up the article. My intention was to rename the article, but I couldn't really figure how to do that. A few questions going forward though, how exactly does one get consensus? How many votes count as a consensus? The last discussion on this page happened 5 years ago, so it doesn't look like people are necessarily flocking to this topic. One could go by popular vote (although that seems a bit anarchic) but in this case, it works: Google produces about 3,000 more articles for "Dong Ding tea" than it does "Tung Ting tea". Also, the article name is reverted but the article content is the same, meaning there is no consistency between what the article says, calling the tea Dong Ding, or the title, the oddly hyphenated Tung-ting. Any help you could provide would be great. For reference as well on the name: http://babelcarp.org/babelcarp/babelcarp.cgi?phrase=Tung+Ting and http://babelcarp.org/babelcarp/babelcarp.cgi?phrase=dong+ding Waliy Sherpa (talk) 18:22, 19 January 2016 (UTC)

   Hi, Waliy Sherpa. If you'll forgive me for presuming, for a moment, i'll speak to you not just in your role as an editing colleague, but also based on my speculating that your WP account name is related to your off-line identity. I once had the honor to be present when Jamling Norgay promoted, IIRC, his autobiography and his calling on behalf of the Sherpa ethnicity, before an audience mainly of American rock climbers and big-mountain fans. He was asked "What do you eat on summit day?" and answered "Snickers, Reese's Pieces.... And tea, of course." So emotionally, at least, i feel obligated to presume anyone with "Sherpa" in their WP account name knows far more about teas than i can ever hope to!
   That being said, what we're discussing here is not just a matter of expertise on tea, but in the case of what is the ideal title, also a matter of what interested editors believe likely users of the article will most likely use in seeking information on this variety or family of teas; in theory, the judgements of people more typical of those who will read the article are what matters, and to the degree we can make those judgements they are more informative.
   IMO the most direct way to approach this is probably for you to start a Requested move process, noting your permissions status (which i'm pretty sure prevents you from doing a non-cut&paste move). I think each RM is processed by adding it to an appropriate list, which should provide awareness of it by editors with more than passing interest in teas, in the relevant international usage issues, etc., and where it will be discussed.
   To flesh out a little more what the problem with your cut-and-paste move was, you can find pages like WP:cut and paste move that will discuss important differences between wikis and other kinds of on-line collaboration. I'll summarize an angle i pretend to understand it from: for both intellectual-property law reasons and keeping the ability, in routine practice, to trace back edit history in "what kind of maniac would contribute an edit like that except as vandalism? Oh, duh, now i get it; why wasn't it obvious to me!" mode, your move was a tiny error that (in light of editors working for free, and, in the big picture) is well worth fixing, as i did.
   Let me say, in case it hasn't been perfectly clear, you did nothing anyone should be angry about. It needed fixing, but doing so was worth the effort it took me, and your grasp of how the monster works has advanced by another step. (FYI, if your reasoning about the best title is recognized as being right, someone with the needed permission will make the name you prefer into the one that designates not just future versions of the article, but the whole chain of different versions, and all of the records of who contributed which parts of the wording.)
   I'm very far from the most expert of WP editors, and probably a jerk more often than i notice, but i'm pretty experienced, and i'll be more often flattered than annoyed if you care to put further questions to me. Happy editing to you!
--Jerzy•t 21:24, 19 January 2016 (UTC)

   It's been a while since i visited that Requested move page. If you go there, you'll see "Requesting that page histories be merged". I've thrown a lot of jargon at you, and lest you worry over that, that step (toward it being possible to do the rename that you have in mind) is the thing i told you i'd gone ahead and done, even if i didn't describe it with wording that you'd immediately recognize it as meaning the same thing. In a line, don't worry about getting the histories merged, that's what i did. What's left is getting consensus on the (or a) better title, and the odds are that whoever is willing to say "I see a consensus" will be someone who cabn and will do the move without further fuss.
--Jerzy•t 07:20 & 07:35, 20 January 2016 (UTC)

Tags

Should there be translation tags from the other language WP pages - several of them have more information. Jackiespeel (talk) 10:45, 19 February 2017 (UTC)