Talk:Surtur (character)

Recommended Reading List

The list needs to remain as these ARE the appearances of Surtur and provide a ready reference for new readers. How else will they find Surtur's appearances?

Not a Demon

Surtur isn't acually a demon. Like Mephisto, he is a force for evil and may appear demonic, but has no connection to Hell.

Asgardian 22:40, 13 October 2006 (UTC)

The Marvel Universe Handbooks do not indicate that a creature has to have a connection to Hell (or even "a" Hell) to be considered demonic. By Christian terms he might not qualify, but we should use Marvel's terms here. -Wilfredo Martinez 19:19, 22 November 2006 (UTC)

Appearance in Thorion of the New Asgods

So, in "Other versions," it says:

The character features in an Amalgam Comics one-shot publication title Thorion of the New Gods, in which he is amalgamated with the DC Comics character Orion.

First of all, the citation refers to something called Thorion of the New Asgods, not of the New Gods. I'm assuming the former is correct.

But more importantly, judging by the title of the comic (and my limited knowledge of Amalgam Comics), it sounds more like there'd be an amalgamation of Thor/Orion, while the article appears to claim that there's an amalgamation of Surtur/Orion (which seems doubtful). I suspect Surtur may appear in that comic, and is possibly amalgamated with some DC character, but I haven't read it, so I don't know what would be correct here. 66.143.167.77 (talk) —Preceding undated comment added 07:22, 10 January 2014 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Thorvs.Surtur.jpg

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BetacommandBot (talk) 02:54, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

Fire demon or fire giant?

Is he a demon or a giant? Was he a giant in 1970 and later retconned as a demon? Are they synonyms and our article text clumsily implies a distinction that doesn't exist?

The text of our article calls him a demon multiple times and implies "fire giant" is what the original myth, as opposed to the comics, had him as, but no source is explicitly cited for the distinction, and the comic cover used to illustrate the article clearly refers to him as "SURTUR THE FIRE GIANT".

Clarification?

Hijiri 88 (聖やや) 05:08, 3 December 2017 (UTC)

Pinging User:Asgardian, who seems to have brought something like this up further up this page 11 years ago, unless I'm mistaken. User:Wilfredo Martinez, although he hasn't been active since 2008. Hijiri 88 (聖やや) 05:11, 3 December 2017 (UTC)

Very powerful prime fire demon. "Giant" is a misnomer. Asgardian (talk) 22:55, 3 December 2017 (UTC)

@Asgardian: Are you sure? The only "official" source that's clearly visible in the article refers to him as a giant, not a demon, and in the original Norse myths he's a giant. This source implies that its author knows the comic character is a demon but isn't sure what the mythological figure is ("being"), which implies that you are correct as far as current continuity goes, but does current continuity have it that the word on the comic cover in the infobox is actually a "misnomer"? Shouldn't this be in the article, or perhaps the image clipped so as not to visibly refer to him as a giant if he is not? I found it very confusing reading our plot summary for the recent film where he was referred to as a demon, since the film itself did not make this clear and I was going in more familiar with the myths than the comics. Hijiri 88 (聖やや) 23:17, 3 December 2017 (UTC)

In Journey Into Mystery #104 (May 1964) Surtur is referred to as a fire demon. Asgardian (talk) 10:14, 5 December 2017 (UTC)

But that's not the same as stating that he is not a fire giant as well. "demon" is an extremely polyvalent term. Plenty of folks would probably say "large fire demon" and "fire giant" are functionally identical, but that the latter "feels" less anachronistic when referring since the Greek (as opposed to Germanic) root of the word "giant" is less well known than that of "demon". Hijiri 88 (聖やや) 10:55, 7 December 2017 (UTC)