Talk:Side-stick

Wording vs. Facts

Only the right hand may thus be used for the stick and both-hands operation is neither possible, nor required.

It seems obvious from the supplied image that the pilot of an airliner, seated customarily on the left, cannot very well use his right hand to operate the side-stick mounted on his left. That would be awkward, and make precise steering difficult. I changed the wording accordingly. Textor (talk) 09:29, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Quite true, the hand used depends on the seat as the stick is outboard in both cases. Thanks for fixing that! - Ahunt (talk) 15:07, 22 February 2011 (UTC)

Yoked controls

In a twin-control aircraft with traditional center sticks, each pilot can sense the effect of the other's actions. I understand that this is not true in a side-stick plane.

What I have not been able to discover is what happens if the pilots make opposite inputs. Does the pilot have to make his side-stick active in order to use it after the other pilot has used his?

A knowledgeable person could certainly improve the article with an answer to this. Fotoguzzi (talk) 16:12, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

It depends greatly on the type of aircraft. The Cirrus SR-22 for instance has mechanical side sticks that operate the same as any mechanical controls, the stronger person wins! In most electrical side stick aircraft there is some means of control transfer so the computers know who to listen to and who to ignore. - Ahunt (talk) 16:53, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

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New Page format could help

This page could be more informative if formatted in a historical style with subheadings to reflect the evolution of the side-stick including safety factors. More technical info already available elsewhere on the web could be added coherently in this style.A5afety (talk) 10:12, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

Sure the article could be done like that, as long as you write it in an encyclopedic and WP:NPOV style and not like your last additions. I would suggest that to save time you propose your new text here for discussion. - Ahunt (talk) 11:51, 17 October 2020 (UTC)

I agree with NPOV but may not get the encyclopedic style quite right yet. Proposed headings/format are-

Description

  EXPANDED- similar to what is already there

1903 - The very first plane

  EXPANDED DETAILS

1974 - First production aircraft debut

  Military F16 EXPANDED DETAILS  include Quadruple redundancy fly-by-wire

Further military fighter adoption

  (First flew). -Dassault Rafale (1986), Mitsubishi F-2 (1995) and F-22 Raptor (1997)  

1987 - First airliner debut

  Airbus A320 EXPANDED DETAILS include Triple redundancy “Passive” fly-by-wire

Further airliner adoption

  (First Flew) -A340 (1991), A330 (1992), A321 (1993), A319 (1995), [into 21st Century] A318 (2002), A380 (2005), A350 (2013). A320NEO (2014)  A319NEO (2017) Sukoi Superjet (2008), A220 (2013) originally as a Bombardier brand

2000- improved “active” side-sticks military debut

  EXPANDED to included them first conceived in 1990 then used from 2000- X32 & X35,  F35 (2006)  

2012 Warnings on “passive“ side-sticks

  EXPANDED to included a 2012 crash report highlights a Hazard- ‘Passive’ side-sticks in multi-crew cockpits, Inadvertent “Dual Input” a Secondary Hazard

2015- Multi-crew transports “active” side-sticks debut

in Embraer KC390 (2015), Gulftstream G500 (2015), G600 (2016)

2019 – First airliner with “active” side-sticks debut

Irkut MC21

This is a rough draft and I welcome feedback A5afety (talk) 22:44, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

In general it looks okay, although most sections could probably be combined. The main thing is not not write it like an attack on Airbus. See WP:NPOV for how to do that. - Ahunt (talk) 23:05, 19 October 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for feedback. So Sandbox next or back to the page..?A5afety (talk) 04:30, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Given the last attempt, I would suggest either propose a new draft here on the talk page or in a sandbox space and let's have a look at it. - Ahunt (talk) 12:41, 20 October 2020 (UTC)

Proposal-Current page needs a new heading listing all accidents involving side-sticks

Firstly there is “Dual input” where two pilots fight each other knowingly or unknowingly, or one knows the other doesn’t, with deadly results. Armavia 967 – A320 (2006), Air France 447 – A330 (2009), Afriqiyah Air 771 – A330 (2010), Air Asia 8501 –A320 (2014). These all are categorised as either the deadliest or 2nd most deadliest crashes of the A320 A330 aircraft types at the time. Secondly, there’s gross misuse of the side-stick by one pilot left unchallenged by the other. e.g. Gulf Air 072, A320 (2000)

I also propose it should also then have separate headings for

1. All warnings given on the 1st generation “passive” side-sticks in 2012. The Daily Telegraph, Fox News and CBS with Sullenberger
2. All aircraft particularly Commercial Air transport with passive side-sticks, Airbus, ComacC919, Embraer, Sukkoi
3. All aircraft with 2nd generation “active” side-sticks. Embraer K390, Gulfstream, Irkut MC-21
4. All Companies that supply “active” side-sticks. BAE 2012, Safran 2014, Collins 2015, Lord Corp 2019

A5afety (talk) 03:57, 17 January 2021 (UTC)

Instead see User_talk:Ahunt#side-stick_new_page_format_finalised_on_sandbox - Ahunt (talk) 20:09, 17 January 2021 (UTC)