Talk:Rhymed prose

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A fact from Rhymed prose appeared on Wikipedia's Main Page in the Did you know column on 30 March 2007. The text of the entry was as follows:

Did you know... that rhymed prose has been popular in various cultures, ranging from medieval Arabic maqamat to modern rap?

A record of the entry may be seen at Wikipedia:Recent additions/2007/March.

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Initial author's comment

A apologize for poor article on such a poetic and rich topic. I created it without having sufficient expertise on the the subject only because I was very surpized to see that the article was absent in wikipedia. Mukadderat 16:28, 30 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Is it prose or poetry?

I don't get it... isn't this just unrigidly metric poetry? Rap I would definitely consider poetry (well, some of it, not most of it) and it is metered, just a time/beat meter and not a syllabic one. I confess not to be an expert on the subject, but poetry doesn't need syllabic meter. "Rhymed prose" seems like poetry that isn't syllabically metrical. Can you give me an example?--Ioshus^(talk) 17:26, 30 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Like I wrote above, I am not really an expert. You probably know that today poetry needs nothing: it doesn't need rhyme, it doesn't need metre, it doesn't need rhythm. There is no mathematic definition in things like this. My understanding that the core difference between poetry and prose does not lie in formal shape of the text, but in its spirit, topics, and the amount of ornamentation. (and by the way I find the wikipedia's article "prose" has bad introduction). Rhymed prose straddles the boundary of prose and poetry. We even sometimes apply the adjective "poetic" to a text in prose.

You write: "Rhymed prose" seems like poetry that isn't syllabically metrical - Yes, this is exactly what definition says, only more cautiously. Once again, don't seek sharp boundaries here. The same text different critics may call both poetry and prose, just like with Dr. Seuss, as you may easily check using google.

This boundary may be swayed by as trivial trick as typography: if you write a plain text in a continuous paragraph, it is prose, but if you split it into lines, it mysteriously poetry.

I know full well now: only my own hands, dark as the earth, can make my earth-dark body free. O thieves, exploiters, killers, no longer shall you say with arrogant eyes and scornful lips: "You are my servant, black man - I, the free!" That day is past.

The text above was written by the earliest rapper I know:

I know full well now

Only my own hands,

Dark as the earth,

Can make my earth-dark body free.

O thieves, exploiters, killers,

No longer shall you say

With arrogant eyes and scornful lips:

"You are my servant,

Black man-

I, the free!"

That day is past.

And finally, there is even such a thing, poem in prose, to make you even more confused :-) Mukadderat 18:54, 30 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. the example above is not of rhymed prose. I intentinally selected an unrhymed poem, for contrast. I hope someone else will add beautiful examples into the article. After all, wikipedia is cooperation. Mukadderat 19:00, 30 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I think this information might go well in the text... the concept that different people may define each of the component terms differently, and therefore may be extremely confusing to the less informed reader. (i just spent all weekend at a poetry workshop, and I still don't understand!!!) --Ioshus^(talk) 03:00, 2 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, but as I wrote, I am not an expert; the answer above is my "original research"; let other people add to the article. Mukadderat 19:33, 2 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Rap (when it's done well) is metrical, though it tends to have accentual meter rather than accentual-syllabic meter.

Dr. Seuss's books are mostly quite metrical, either anapestic (as in the Lorax) or trochaic or iambic tetrameter (as in The Cat in the Hat).

A better example of rhymed prose in English would be the jokey long-lined poems that comprise a large fraction of Ogden Nash's output.

65.213.77.129 (talk) 16:02, 28 March 2008 (UTC)[reply]

rap

1. Why is rap listed in the "European Cultures" section?
2.a. If it is both rhythmic and rhyming, how is it prose? Being "spoken" does not make it prose.
2.b. Moreover rap is not spoken. It is rapped!

On the basis of #2, I removed rap from the article. If for some reason someone puts it back in the article, please don't put it under the heading of European Culture ... since is is (primarily) African American. Of course one might say North America is "European in culture," but I think rap is as good an example as any indicating N.A. should not be oversimplified into that category.
Ventifact (talk) 03:06, 12 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]