Talk:List of fictional schools

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List of fictional magic schools was nominated for deletion. The discussion was closed on 27 November 2020 with a consensus to merge. Its contents were merged into List of fictional schools. The original page is now a redirect to this page. For the contribution history and old versions of the redirected article, please see its history; for its talk page, see here.

This article was nominated for deletion on 28 August 2007. The result of the discussion was no consensus.

This article was nominated for deletion on 7 June 2010. The result of the discussion was delete.

This article was nominated for deletion on 26 July 2020. The result of the discussion was keep.

This page was proposed for deletion by Boleyn (talk · contribs) on 26 July 2020.

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Limit to individually notable entries?

Might I suggest that this list be limited to blue-linked entries or those established as significant via third-party sourcing? DonIago (talk) 16:56, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah that's pretty much the way it's supposed to be. Sadly, article's like these are incredibly hard to manage.★Trekker (talk) 16:58, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Want me to grab my hedge clippers? DonIago (talk) 18:10, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Gladly. It's probably for the better that way.★Trekker (talk) 18:12, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

It's a pretty sad article now. Can't really say whether that's for the best, but it's hard for me to think of many schools that would both fit on this list and which anyone has taken note of. Starfleet Academy is the only one that readily springs to mind, and it's here. DonIago (talk) 18:38, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

It is, I'm actually surprised that there seemed to be so little of value in the article. It's probably going to get filled again but I'll try to add sources if it does.★Trekker (talk) 18:59, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

You know, given there's not even a List of fictional schools article to begin with, I really wonder what the point of this particularly specialized list is. Perhaps it should be renamed and expanded to make it more...useful. DonIago (talk) 20:23, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah I see what you mean. I think that might be a good idea. List of fictional schools seems like a good way to go. List of fictional location types and strangely enough List of fictional magic schools exist.★Trekker (talk) 20:55, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I'm comfortable moving the page and editing as needed, if you'd like. Otherwise, feel free, unless someone speaks up before you see this (I'm not crossing my fingers). DonIago (talk) 21:43, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

That seems good. I'll change the fictional military template when you do.★Trekker (talk) 22:14, 30 November 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Hopefully we're all set...I actually found something to add in the process, but (perhaps not surprisingly) most of the links to this article seem to have been added by IPs with no consideration for whether the fictional school was especially significant, much less blue-linked or such. DonIago (talk) 18:04, 1 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

That's the absolute truth. Great job by the way.★Trekker (talk) 03:22, 2 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks! DonIago (talk) 14:40, 2 December 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Why should the list only include blue links? Kdammers (talk) 11:13, 28 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

We needed some sort of inclusion criteria, and bluelinks or third-party sourcing seemed like reasonable choices. Do you have an alternate suggestion? DonIago (talk) 13:03, 28 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

While I realize there can be the problem of bloat and a question of what criteria could otherwise be used, I would like to allow institutions that are mentioned (or more than just mentioned) in fictional works without having to be blue-link worthy (or blue-linked or sourced). I know there is a Wikipedia policy of non-inheritance of significance, but I think that can be taken too far. For example, in normal (narrative) articles, not every fact, person, location, event etc. that is discussed needs to be blue-link worthy. Why should lists have to have a 'higher standard'? (I am thinking of a couple of things here, one of which makes me a bit non-objective. That confounding factor is my experience trying to get a fictional religion listed on the List of fictional religions. The religion is central to two blue-linked books by Chaim Potok, but I couldn't find any scholarly discussions of the fictional religion -- and I didn't feel they should have been necessary, but I was over-ruled. The second thing is closer to hand; The school in Madam Secretary (a television series) that is pictured and comes up a lot. I think this is something readers of Wikipedia would like to be able to find.) Kdammers (talk) 16:08, 28 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

With WP:IINFO in mind, I would most likely have to oppose loosening the standards on this article such that a school could be added merely on the grounds that it was mentioned in a notable work. To my mind that fails to be significant for much of the same reasoning discussed at WP:IPCV. Or as I like to put it, we shouldn't just establish that the tree fell in the woods, but that it made a sound when it fell. If it's the standard itself that's confounding you, my suggestion would be that you start a discussion at the page that discusses the standard. DonIago (talk) 16:19, 28 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

URLs and blue links are not established as the only basis for inclusion in Wikipedia. I don't see that stated in WP:IINFO or elsewhere. There is a lot of reality, with and without secondary reference material, all of which is not on the Internet. Could someone besides the three people in this discussion chime in? Kdammers (talk) 04:24, 12 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Don Iago, would you accept https://transcripts.foreverdreaming.org/viewtopic.php?f=456&t=22828 as adequate to include Lovell University? (The school is also mentioned in the Wikipedia article on 'Madam Secretary' as well as being the setting or at least partial setting in other episodes.) Kdammers (talk) 04:33, 12 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

I would not, as that link is a transcript and in no way establishes that the school is considered significant by independent sources. DonIago (talk) 03:27, 13 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

If an entire TV series is set at a fictional university, and revolves around academic politics there, then that university ought surely to be listed here. Beyond that, I'll go back to looking after List of fictional British and Irish universities: it has clear inclusion criteria and plenty of sources. When I saw a review of The Chair I was looking forward to adding it to that list, but was then disappointed to find that it's on the wrong side of the pond, so reckoned this article was the place for it. PamD 16:59, 21 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Pretty thin database?

Why has a list of fictional schools no Hogwarts in it (which would of course include the other two notable schools from Potter stories: Beauxbatons and Durmstrang)? No St Trinians academy? Bunker Hill Military Academy (from the Tom Cruise Movie "Taps")? Buffy should have two or three of these... or do Universities get their own list?

I can see why to limit it to schools that are somewhat important and not just from decently popular backgrounds, but three entries and no editor could improve on it? Puh-lease. There must be at least a hundred entries that would have no doubt the necessary grade of notability if Starfleet Academy is accepted. Maybe it's a problem with fishing out invented schools from in between proper ones with fictional events happening?--5.146.47.75 (talk) 15:34, 10 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I think it's more that most editors either don't know about this article or don't care enough to improve it (shrug). Maybe bring it up at WP:WPLISTS? DonIago (talk) 15:58, 10 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

I've actually been planning on merging the List of fictional magic schools article into this for a while but I haven't taken the time to do it.★Trekker (talk) 16:23, 10 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Madam Secretary

As far as I can tell (searching Wikipedia), Bayard University on Madam Secretary is fictitious as is Hamilton High. BU is present in many episodes; Hamilton maybe only in madam-secretary#4-15 as a mention. Kdammers (talk) 11:11, 28 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I had never heard of Madam Secretary and find that it is mainly a political drama. Its page says little about schools and so they don't seem to be an important aspect of the topic. What readers will expect in this list are those cases where the school is an important location in the story. For example, the shows in the List of television series about school. Andrew🐉(talk) 13:12, 13 August 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Source for expansion

This splendid blog, by the Registrar (ie top executive) of a respected UK university, offers a list, indeed a ranking, of fictional universities. I've used it as a source from which to chase up entries for the List of fictional British and Irish universities, but it's an international list - and his top-ranked university, Winchester University, doesn't get a listing in this list or in wikipedia - it redirects to the real, similarly-named but entirely different, British, University of Winchester. (I've now added a hatnote there for it). Someone might like to follow up on the items in that list to expand this one? Unfortunately the author has now retired from blogging, so there won't be an update (there are 2 earlier lists, published in 2015 and 2018). Happy Editing! PamD 17:06, 21 August 2021 (UTC)[reply]