Talk:List of prime ministers of Israel

1977

I'd always thought Peres was acting/interim prime minister from April to June 1977, but this article claims that Rabin stayed on the whole time. john k (talk) 13:04, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

National unity governments

I can't help but feel that the labeling of national unity governments to be subjective. In what sense is the current government a national unity one? Netanyahu can drop Labor from his government and still have a majority in the Knesset. Why is Olmert's government not a national unity one? The socialist Labor with the centrist Kadima (right leaning in it's economic platform) isn't exactly a natural alliance. Why is the 14th Knesset (Netanyahu's first term) labeled Likud? Labor had more votes that election. What of the 30th government? The 29th? The 13th?

In short, I feel that by attempting to label national unity governments/hung Knessets, we're straying from the realm of facts, and entering the realm of opinion. I believe this should be avoided. Rami R 12:21, 12 July 2010 (UTC)

The table, as it stands, colours governments inaccurately: the table currently suggests that in 1986–88, Shamir led a Likud government in a Labor Knesset. This is not correct. Shamir led a national unity government in a hung Knesset. Admittedly, my chosen method of resolving this with neutral colour isn't particularly satisfactory, but it remains inaccurate. BartBassist (talk) 17:17, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

Not necessarily inaccurate: The alignment was the larger party, and it was it that was asked by the president to form a government. However these are just technicalities, and in essence you are right. Perhaps a solution is to avoid coloring the Knessets all together. Rami R 21:23, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

I'll go ahead and colour governments and Knessets as neutral, as an experiment (it can easily be reverted, and Rami seems to have particular experience in reverting edits). Ideally, of course, the list for a political system which is prone to coalition governments should list all the parties in government, like the post-1949 German Chancellors or the post-1918 Prime Ministers of the Netherlands. I'm not sure that we have the column-space (width) to do the same here. BartBassist (talk) 09:04, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

Coloring is acceptable. As you say, listing the coalition partners would be ideal, but impractical due to the usual size of Israeli coalitions (and I'm happy to see my experience is noticed :P) Rami R 10:44, 15 July 2010 (UTC)

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New alias

Have “Israeli prime ministers” redirect here. Cup o’ Java (talk • edits) 23:21, 25 April 2015 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 15 May 2018

All the PMs have weird birth/death dates like David Ben-Gurion: 1973-1886...

ALL PMs birth/death dates have somehow been manipulated...or something is wrong with me or my laptop... Besserwissern (talk) 17:12, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

 Not done: It must be you or your laptop, because David Ben-Gurion's birth/death date says 1886-1973, not the other way around. You may have the numbers switched around due to smaller screens squashing table, but this is not very probable. Feel free the re-open this edit request if further assistance is needed. L293D (☎ • ✎) 18:58, 15 May 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 8 July 2018

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

The result of the move request was: No Consensus. עם ישראל חי (talk) (non-admin closure)15:19, 19 July 2018 (UTC)

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List of Prime Ministers of Israel → List of prime ministers of Israel – MOS:JOBTITLES and extensive discussion about the same Talk:List of Presidents of the United States which is still ongoing. It might be better if there was a community consensus about how this applies to all articles. Seraphim System ^(talk) 14:56, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

• Oppose per almost all other articles in Category:Lists of prime ministers, some of which are featured lists (e.g. this) and therefore have presumably already received heavy scutiny without a move being deemed necessary. Also, this needs to be a mass RM, not done on a piecemeal basis. Number 57 15:06, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

@Number 57: Then please comment on the Presidents of the United States RfC. I'm not sure how something like that should be done, but I think the discussion should be had for all articles. The featured lists should definitely be discussed as well and the style should be consistent across articles. Right now the consensus seems to be leaning against capitalization.Seraphim System ^(talk) 16:24, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

To editor Seraphim System: please, where is this RfC being held and discussed?  Paine Ellsworth  ^put'r there  13:41, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

@Paine Ellsworth: I'm not sure - there are some proposals that the whole discussion needs to go back to the MOS talk pages. Some think it should have been resolved by Talk:List_of_Vice_Presidents_of_the_United_States#Requested_move_21_May_2018 which was a no consensus close. Have you heard back from the closer of that RfC?Seraphim System ^(talk) 13:51, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

To editor Seraphim System: yes, yet no resolution at this point. Apparently we are a bit conflicted as to under what circumstances RMs don't need to be held. I think an RfC on an appropriate Manual of Style talk page would be best, so I'll wait for that.  Paine Ellsworth  ^put'r there  14:42, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

• Opposed - Plural, but not generic. To explain: Yes, we do not capitalize in List of prime ministers, because the singular “prime minister” is NOT a specific title in that context, it is generic. We retain the non-capitalization of the singular when pluralized. However, the title “Prime Minister of Israel” IS a specific title (NOT generic) and is capitalized in the singular. So, it should retain its capitalization when pluralized. Blueboar (talk) 16:57, 8 July 2018 (UTC)
• Support. I've seen no substantiation to support the assertion that any title of any office holder should retain its proper-noun status when it refers to more than one (plural) office holders. Whenever an office is made plural, it becomes a common noun and must not be uppercased. Just because "Queen of England" was a title, nobody would write that Mary, Elizabeth, and Anne were Queens of England, rather than queens of England, would they? What might make this slippery is to realize different ways to put it. One would write that "Anne Boleyn was Queen of England", or one could put it that "Anne Boleyn was a queen of England", so even when an office term is singular, it could still be a common noun dependent upon context. In the context of this list, "prime ministers" is a common-noun phrase and should be lowercased.  Paine Ellsworth  ^put'r there  19:20, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

I would ABSOLUTELY write “There have been five reigning Queens of England: Elizabeth I, Mary I, Mary II, Ann, and Elizabeth II.” Blueboar (talk) 01:09, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

I still say that's poor grammar and that when "queens" is plural, it becomes a descriptor, which is a common noun that should be lowercased. Winston Churchill was a prime minister (descriptor) of the United Kingdom, one of several prime ministers (descriptor) of the UK. List of prime ministers of the United Kingdom appears to be yet another redirect to a grammatical error. When the office title is used as a descriptor, our MOS is clear: Avoid capitalization of titles except when [...] the position/office is the subject itself, and the term is the actual title or conventional translation thereof (not a description or rewording). A plural is a descriptor, because there is no such office as "Prime Ministers of the United Kingdom" or "Vice Presidents of Nabisco". The moment that someone is awarded one of those (plural) titles, that is the moment you become correct. Until then...  Paine Ellsworth  ^put'r there  06:56, 12 July 2018 (UTC)

• Comment. Wikipedia:Manual of Style/Biography was just changed a couple of weeks ago after a short discussion. It's now far more confusing and I don't believe reflects consensus any longer, as evidenced by recent discussions at Talk:List of Vice Presidents of the United States and Talk:List of Presidents of the United States, where I've also commented, as well as the category mentioned by Number 57 above. The longstanding previous version of the guideline was under the heading "Occupational titles". It also seems out of sync with Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style#Titles_of_people and especially Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Capital_letters#Titles_of_people. The change should probably be reverted or discussed on the guideline's talk page. Station1 (talk) 19:32, 8 July 2018 (UTC)

yeah... Up until about a year ago, our various guidelines were essentially in sync (most of them sharing the “old” wording you linked to above). Then, as the “Cap/Decap wars” heated up, one by one they were each changed (to either support or oppose caps in job titles). I am thinking we should return them all to the “synced” versions... and hold a centralized discussion to figure out what consensus is). Blueboar (talk) 01:04, 10 July 2018 (UTC)

Definitely worth doing. It is consistently difficult to sort through these discussions and try to find some sort of consensus. Dekimasuよ! 18:31, 15 July 2018 (UTC)

• Defer to Talk:List_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States#Requested_move_20_May_2018. If that doesn't find a consensus, it calls for an RfC on Wikipedia:Manual_of_Style/Biography#Positions,_offices,_and_occupational_titles. The MOS is a good idea, but there can be exceptions. --SmokeyJoe (talk) 04:33, 18 July 2018 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 12 July 2019

The dates that PM Netanyahu will become the longest serving Prime Minister of Israel, is wrong. Ben Gurion served 4,875 days (2083 in first term & 2792 in second term). As of July 12, 2019, PM Netanyahu served 4,868 days (1113 in first term & 3755 days in second term).

See graph of days that will take Netanyahu to get to 4,875 & 4,876 days: July 12, 4868 days July 13, 4869 July 14, 4870 July 15, 4871 July 16, 4872 July 17, 4873 July 18, 4874 July 19, 4875 July 20, 4876 days

PLEASE CHANGE X CURRENT:

1. If Netanyahu serves continuously as Prime Minister on July 16, 2019, he will tie Ben-Gurion to become the longest serving Prime Minister in Israel's history. He will break that record for himself one day later on July 17, 2019.

TO Y CORRECT:

1. If Netanyahu serves continuously as Prime Minister on July 19, 2019, he will tie Ben-Gurion to become the longest serving Prime Minister in Israel's history. He will break that record for himself one day later on July 20, 2019. Shemtov613 (talk) 16:01, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

 Done —Compassionate727 ^(T·C) 18:39, 12 July 2019 (UTC)

~The graph isn't updating properly. If you sign in it shows one date ("as of Jul. 19") and before you sign in it says ("as of Jul. 17). This should be fixed. Ypostelnik (talk) 08:17, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

@Ypostelnik: Are you saying that signing in makes the difference? If you sign back out, does it go back to saying "as of Jul. 17"? If not, then what you were experiencing was the server purging the cache. Wikimedia retains cached versions of all of our articles, which are what you retrieve when you load the page; if we actually rebuilt the page from the source every time someone loaded it, the servers would crash. Every time someone modifies the page, this automatically purges the cache; additionally, if I recall correctly, the servers reconstruct the caches of a few million articles every hour. My guess would be that the cache of this page was purged and rebuilt between the time you first viewed the article and the time you logged in, and thus the template rendering the current date was updated to reflect what that template currently says. In the future, if a page is displaying an old date, you can add ?action=purge to the page's URL and proceed to that page, which will manually purge the article you are viewing and then reload it. You can also, in your gadgets, enable one that adds a purge option to the drop-down menus next to your search bar, which does the same thing. —Compassionate727 ^(T·C) 13:56, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

Hi, thanks. I did try signing out then, and yes, it went back to Jul. 17. It's fine now though and was probably a glitch when someone changed the updater to count total days instead of years and year to date. Ypostelnik (talk) 18:37, 20 July 2019 (UTC)

It should be updated to say he tied Ben-Gurion and put Netanyahu on top and Ben-Gurion between him and Shamir. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.245.88.115 (talk) 18:39, 19 July 2019 (UTC)

Why does the amount of days update on this page that is a past edit but the current one only goes up to July 20? https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=List_of_Prime_Ministers_of_Israel&diff=907106632&oldid=907014231 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 96.245.88.115 (talk) 05:19, 22 July 2019 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 13 June 2021

Change Naftali Bennett's party listing from "New Right" to "Yamina" with "New Right" italicized under it. Precedent for this page shows that the Prime Minister's political alliance is listed, with their party italicized below it. Adam (talk) 21:25, 13 June 2021 (UTC)

@AdamG2016: Done. Number 57 21:39, 13 June 2021 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 20 June 2022

The Coalition has fallen, Bennett has resigned and Lapid is Prime Minister until October. Clearly this has to be acknowledged. Lapid has to be added immediately.Notwisconsin (talk) 00:49, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

Per the coalition agreement, Lapid does not become Prime Minister until the Knesset votes to dissolve itself. That vote is scheduled for later this week or next week. Lapid will be added once he becomes PM, but until then, Bennett is still the Prime Minister. Jacoby531 (talk) 00:57, 21 June 2022 (UTC)

Extended-confirmed-protected edit request on 3 July 2022

The date range for Bennett in the list is wrong. It is currently 13 June 2021 – 1 July 2022, but must be 13 June 2021 – 30 June 2022 Lapid became Prime Minister at midnight so Bennett was no longer Prime Minister on 1 July 2022 CrazyPredictor (talk) 00:24, 3 July 2022 (UTC)

Done. I added a note as well to explain the apparent gap between the two terms. Hopefully that is helpfulJacoby531 (talk) 00:55, 3 July 2022 (UTC)

References

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Why is Yesh Atid marked in Blue?

And a similar blue to Herut/Likud at that? Its article says it's a "centrist liberal" party so shouldn't yellow or gold be the colour like with the Liberal Democrats in Britain? I intend to change this once I've figured out how the coding works - or unless anyone can offer a valid reason why it should be almost the same colour as Likud.Romomusicfan (talk) 00:06, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

Have left a note on user 沁水湾's talk page about this as they have also raised the issue at Module talk:Political party/Archive 2#Yesh Atid's color. hopefully together we can fix this.Romomusicfan (talk) 07:57, 19 May 2023 (UTC)

The party's position is completely irrelevant as to its colour. Yesh Atid's party colour is blue. Number 57 16:13, 20 May 2023 (UTC)

A lot about a party's position can be implied from its colour. Yesh Atid's colour is blue and orange.

Numbering

Is there a reason that non-consecutive terms of prime ministers don't result in an additional number being added? I'm sure there must be some sort of policy basis, but where can we find it? Criticalus (talk) 01:00, 26 July 2023 (UTC)

Suggested new article

There would be at least as much interest for a Historical rankings of prime ministers of Israel as there is currently for the article Historical rankings of prime ministers of the United Kingdom. Would an acknowledged expert rise to the occasion? Amyzex (talk) 22:24, 23 August 2024 (UTC)