Talk:Irish experiment (Australian rules football)

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Scope of the article

I noted that User:Tameamseo deleted quite a few recent recruits off the list stating that they hadn't actually been "recruited". Exactly what constitutes being recruited needs to be fleshed out a bit. I would define that any player who trains with an AFL club, moves to Australia or is offered an AFL contract by a club should be listed here. That is the nature of an "experiment" - it doesn't always work out.

Players like Sean Cavanagh never pulled on a jumper, however the attempt to secure him by Brisbane created significant controversy.

Personally I think the list should be comprehensive including players who were brought to Australia to train with clubs or play in practice matches. This is to show the extent of recruitment drives by various clubs and the balance between the players that actually end up playing AFL matches and the number who instead went on to play other sports. --Rulesfan (talk) 00:23, 6 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This is about the scope of the list, not of the overall article. I deleted the players from the list because obviously enough they did not meet the criteria for a "List of Irish players recruited by AFL clubs" if they were not actually recruited by AFL clubs. Being offered a contract or spedning a period training with a club surely is not enough to be described as having been "recruited" to play in the AFL. If it's agreed to change the title of the list and to use new criteria such as those User:Rulesfan has already inserted then I of course have no objection to including those players if they verifiably meet the new criteria. I would agree that a case like the attempt to secure Seán Cavanagh is worthy of inclusion somewhere in the article even if he turned down the offer and never kicked an Australian rules football. However he was clearly not actually "recruited" so he shouldn't be on a list of "recruited" sportsmen. I've further altered the list title and Rulesfan's criteria. Tameamseo (talk) 15:03, 6 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Excellent work Tameaseo, I think this works really well with the article. Would it be ok to add those players back in ? Cheers. --Rulesfan (talk) 02:05, 7 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Thanks, and good work on your part also. No problem with adding the players back, but I'd like references for them meeting the new criteria so I've temporarily removed the uncited ones - Dias, Tuohy and Sheehan - until we have sources. Tameamseo (talk) 22:33, 7 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Move the list to separate article?

Hi all,
The the list, to my mind, dominates the article, at the expense of article quality:

It takes up most of the space;
The "notes" column in the table rightly contains refs and comments, but I would argue these enlarge the table at the expense of readability;
While the article itself is non-contentious, the list entries are controvertible.

Should we perhaps move it to List of Irish Sportsmen Linked with the VFL/AFL and retain a Irish_experiment#Notable_Irish_Sportsmen_Linked_with_the_VFL/AFL section for the most notable Irish Experiment players?
--Shirt58 (talk) 12:21, 6 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Hi all, The 'Other' list of players was deleted recently which I felt lost a lot of valuable information on the Irish Experiment. I undid this change. I think the list should have another home or remain on this page rather than being deleted. Wikiwik-football (talk) 12:39, 21 May 2019 (UTC)[reply]

A further colour highlight in "the list" for Irish sportsmen who have played at least one senior VFL/AFL game?

Hi all,
I suggest something like this:

Highlighted players in green are currently on an AFL senior list
Highlighted players in yellow are currently on an AFL supplementary list
Highlighted players in blue played at least one game at VFL/AFL senior level
Bolded VFL/AFL club name indicates that the player was the first Irish recruit for that club

Year	Player	GAA	Initial VFL club	Draft status	VFL/AFL Debut	VFL/AFL Matches	Notes
1982	Sean Wight	Kerry	Melbourne	rookie	1985	150	Melbourne's first Irish recruit. Had a serviceable career at Melbourne.
1983	Paul Earley	Roscommon	Melbourne			1	Returned to Ireland.
1984	Jim Stynes	Dublin	Melbourne	rookie	1987	264	Won the Brownlow Medal in 1991. Inducted into the Australian Football Hall of Fame in 2003.
1985	James Fahy	Dublin	Melbourne				Returned to Ireland.
1987	Dermot McNicholl	Derry	St Kilda			3	St Kilda's first Irish player returned to Ireland in 1990 because his university refused to let him defer his course any longer.
1988	Tom Grehan	Roscommon	Melbourne				Stayed with the Demons for 2 years.
1989	Niall Buckley	Kildare	Melbourne	1989 National Draft (Pick 77)			Returned to Ireland.
1989	Colin Corkery	Cork	Carlton				Carlton's first Irish recruit returned to Ireland in 1992.
1989	Colm McManamon	Mayo	Geelong				Returned to Ireland in 1992.
1990	Brian Stynes	Dublin	Melbourne	rookie	1992	2	Younger brother of Jim Stynes. Represented Ireland in Australian rules football.
1990	Anthony Tohill	Derry	Melbourne				Broke his leg playing Aussie Rules and returned to Ireland in 1991
2000	Nicholas Walsh	Cavan	Melbourne	2001 AFL Draft (rookie)			Spent three years in Australia.^[1] Injured and delisted in 2003.
2001	Kevin Devine	Dublin	Melbourne	2001 AFL Draft (rookie)			Injured then delisted in 2002
2001	Tadhg Kennelly	Kerry	Sydney	2001 AFL Draft (rookie)	2001	158	Sydney's first Irish player was also the first to win an AFL premiership medallion (in 2005)^[2]^[3]^[4] and his much celebrated AFL career led to renewed interest in Irish recruitment. Retired from AFL before 2009 with one year remaining in his contract to return to Ireland as he wanted the chance to win an All-Ireland Senior Football Championship medal.
2001	Bernie Collins	Cork	Western Bulldogs	2001 AFL Draft (rookie)			The Western Bulldog's first Irish recruit never played a senior game

... and so on. Looking for your opinions about this proposal.--Shirt58 (talk) 11:53, 21 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Colleagues, I'm being bold. Hope this will be OK with you.--Shirt58 (talk) 10:17, 29 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ http://lions.com.au/tabid/5085/default.aspx?newsid=54426
^ "Swans' Irish experiment ready to throw off his tag". http://www.theage.com.au The Age. 2003-01-20. Retrieved 2008-10-25. {{cite web}}: External link in |publisher= (help)
^ "Keeping Irish eyes smiling". http://collingwoodfc.com.au Collingwood Football Club. 2007-10-23. Retrieved 2008-10-25. {{cite web}}: External link in |publisher= (help)
^ Cite error: The named reference IrishExaminer_GarryLyon_TheIrishExperiment was invoked but never defined (see the help page).

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[1] ttp://lions.com.au/tabid/5085/default.aspx?newsid=54426

[AFL_Age_TheIrishExperiment-2] "Swans' Irish experiment ready to throw off his tag". http://www.theage.com.au The Age. 2003-01-20. Retrieved 2008-10-25. {{cite web}}: External link in |publisher= (help)

[Collingwood_MartyClark_IrishExperimentRef-3] "Keeping Irish eyes smiling". http://collingwoodfc.com.au Collingwood Football Club. 2007-10-23. Retrieved 2008-10-25. {{cite web}}: External link in |publisher= (help)

[IrishExaminer_GarryLyon_TheIrishExperiment-4] Cite error: The named reference IrishExaminer_GarryLyon_TheIrishExperiment was invoked but never defined (see the help page).

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