Talk:Ontario Highway 413/GA1

GA Review

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Reviewer: Mcguy15 (talk · contribs) 14:43, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

Hi, I'll be reviewing this GAN! It might be a little slower than expected because this is my first time and I would like to read through the criteria / essays with precision. Mcguy15 (talk, contribs) 14:43, 2 July 2021 (UTC)

No worries, take your time. I'm pretty familiar with things, so hopefully we'll have a mutually beneficial exchange here :) Just {{ping}} me when you're done. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 23:02, 4 July 2021 (UTC)

Hey, Floydian, I'm done! This article was a very interesting read, thanks for improving it. Let me know if you have any feedback for my GA review, because as I said, it was my first one. :) As someone who lives west of the GTA, the proposed construction of the highway baffles me— I can think of just a few any routes that would be benefited from it. — Mcguy15 (talk, contribs) 16:18, 7 July 2021 (UTC)

To your last bit, all you gotta see is the insane number of shipping/distribution centres that have opened up in that area these past 2 years! Anyways, I've responded to your points as need be, indented. Anything with no response (except a couple wikilink requests in the Route description) I have fixed as per your suggestions.

As for feedback... consider doing reviews at WP:FAC, as this was a very detailed examination of the article. Some of this may not really fall under the WP:WIAGA criteria. But, since I'm hoping to eventually take this to FAC, I appreciate and work with it regardless; thank you! The two maps I mention making below will probably take me a week or two to complete, but they're on the to-do list! - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

Everything looks good, thank you! I'm fine with all of the objections you made (replied to a few) This gets a ✓ Pass! Sorry for being too detailed haha, maybe I will go a FAC one day. — Mcguy15 (talk, contribs) 15:47, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)
It is reasonably well written. a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists): It is factually accurate and verifiable. a (references): b (citations to reliable sources): c (OR): d (copyvio and plagiarism): It is broad in its coverage. a (major aspects): b (focused): It follows the neutral point of view policy. Fair representation without bias: It is stable. No edit wars, etc.: It is illustrated by images, where possible and appropriate. a (images are tagged and non-free images have fair use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
Overall: Pass/Fail:
· · ·

Lead and infobox

• Move "Some stakeholders have referred to the [...] a route number from the MTO" to the first paragraph of the lead.
• Wikilink Brampton
• The note in the infobox on "Proposed September 2003" is unneeded. One can read the History section for that information instead.

Route description

• Consider changing "Route description" header to "Proposed route"
• Specify who wrote / published the "Technically Preferred Route report"
• Wikilink transitway (Bus rapid transit)
  • Already linked in the opening sentence of the article... not sure it's necessary again so soon thereafter, per MOS:OVERLINK / MOS:REPEATLINK. This applies to most of the similar requests listed below (except Humber River, which I've linked). - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Change "Fifteen interchanges are proposed." to "Fifteen interchanges were proposed."
• Change "Four of those interchanges, including the ones at each end of the route, would be freeway-to-freeway." to "Four of the interchanges, including the terminuses, would be freeway-to-freeway."
  • Done, just with "termini", which is the plural I use in many other freeway articles in Ontario.
• The regions link is not clear. (See: MOS:LINKCLARITY)
  • The term "region" for Ontario (as well as "county" or "District") is what are actually known as upper-tier municipalities. This is the best article we have covering the subject by far. However, I made it link to the appropriate section of the target article. Otherwise I'd just be removing the link. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Change "northwest into York Region" to "northwest into the York Region"
• York Region is a proper name, "the" would be incorrect in this case. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Wikilink Highway 401 and Highway 407ETR
• Change "An interchange with Peel Regional Road 107 (Bovaird Drive) would lie just east of where that road becomes Highway 7 at the Brampton – Halton Hills boundary" to "It would intersect Regional Road 107 (Bovaird Drive), which is known as Highway 7 to the west after the Brampton–Halton Hills boundary." (note that " – " is replaced with "–" for consistency within the article).
  • I've changed it to a slightly tweaked version of this, as intersect is the wrong term. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Wikilink Caledon
• Wikilink Highway 410
• Wikilink Bolton
• "the route would curve east to pass between the town of Bolton" How could it curve east? To me, at least on the map, the route looks like it continues going east until the end; if anything it curves slightly south.
  • It's actually going northeast for the most part north of Brampton. Local maps of Peel are often skewed about 45 degrees northwest. Toronto and York maps are often skewed at about 16 degrees. While it does dip slightly south (by about 300 metres) between The Gore Road and Mayfield Road, the predominate direction is eastward until the proposed Highway 427 extension. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Wikilink Humber River
• Wikilink Highway 400

History

2002 to 2018

• Expand and wikilink first instance of MTO.
  • This one I'll do, since it
• Why is North-South Corridor Feasibility Study italicized?
  • This is a case where MOS:TITLE is unclear what a published independent study counts as. I figured it counts as a full publication, and should be italicised as a book would. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Wikilink Controlled-access highway
  • Although I normally would not, I suppose this one has also gone unmentioned for a while. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Inconsistent italics: why are "Places to Grow Act" and "North-South Corridor Feasibility Study" in italics but "Central Ontario Strategic Transportation Directions study" and "Growth Plan for the Greater Golden Horseshoe" are not.
  • Good catch... apparently acts of government are not italicised nor surrounded in quotes, but the other two should be italicised. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• "Following the submission of a Terms of Reference" clarify what a Terms of Reference is.
  • Wikilinked it, too technical to explain in the article. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Change "EA" to "Environmental Assessment (EA)"
  • Why? This is an ideal case for the use of that template I think, no? (I kinda feel the same way about the similar example below) - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
    • Yeah sorry, this wasn't a necessary or correct suggestion. — Mcguy15 (talk, contribs) 15:47, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Change "with the Guelph–Kitchener/Waterloo–Cambridge." to "with Guelph and the Waterloo Region."
• Change "from Kitchener/Waterloo to Vaughan" to "between Kitchener/Waterloo and Vaughan"
• Wikilink first instance of Vaughan
• Change "North-South Corridor Feasibility Study" to "North–South Corridor Feasibility Study" (MOS:DASH)
• Change "recommended a north-south" to "recommended a north–south"
• If possible, an image detailing the routes would be extremely helpful for visualizing them.
  • Didn't even think of that, great idea. I could trace the map in the report into a vector image. That won't be a short task though.
    • I'm glad!
• Change "opposition to the corridor began to materialize" to "opposition to the corridor began to appear" (or "take place")
• Wikilink 2018 provincial election (2018 Ontario general election)

2018 to present

• Change "Premier Kathleen Wynne" to "Premier Kathleen Wynne"
• Wikilink Doug Ford
• Remove EA abbr (either keep as EA or write "Environmental Assessment (EA)")
  • See above regarding same issue - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Change "announced that he'd" to "announced that he had"
• Abbreviate "undergo environmental assessment" to "undergo an EA"

Impacts and environmental concerns

• Change "The highway will travel through both the Greenbelt, the Whitebelt" to "The highway would travel through both the Greenbelt, the Whitebelt"
• Change "Watersheds" to "watersheds"
• De-hyphenate "species-at-risk"
• Change "that 'Agricultural land" to "that 'agricultural land"
• Consider using a {{To USD}} for the money amounts in the quote (possibly in a footnote) or clarify the amounts are in CAD.
  • It was in a quote, but I made it C$ (standard shorthand for Canadian Dollar). - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Wikilink highways 412, and 418.
• Change "stakeholders have suggested investment in local transportation improvements" to "stakeholders have suggested investing in local transportation improvements"
• Remove second wikilink of Highway 407 and move it to first mention of it in the section.
• Change "Examples suggested include" to "Some proposed suggestions include"
• Change "public transit investment" to "public transit investments"

Perspectives

• Change "The majority of local municipalities have opposed the project, with [...] opposing the project" to "The majority of local municipalities have opposed the project, including [...]"
• Change "that they will scrap" to "that they would scrap"
• Change "freeway include York Region[77] (a regional municipality) as" to "freeway include the Regional Municipality of York[77] as"
• Wikilink "Progressive Conservative"

Exit list

• Replace all spaced en dashes with en dashes (for consistency within the article)
  • This is the way they should be displayed per WP:RJL. See also the "separating parts of a list" or "when used as punctuation" lines in MOS:DASH. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Are these footnotes really necessary? Any further explanation they provide should have been explained in the Route description section. (Or could be moved there)
  • They're more of a detailed aside that would be too distracting in the text. Standard fare. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Change "County" heading to "Municipality"
  • Weird, that was using the wrong header template. It now displays the proper "Division"
• Why does "Bridge over the Credit River" extend into the Notes row?
  • Standard practise per WP:RJL#What_to_include - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
    • Sorry, I wasn't aware of that section of the MOS! — Mcguy15 (talk, contribs) 15:47, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

Source review

• WSP. "Frequently Asked Questions – GTA West". is a deadlink.
  • Fixed - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Seems a bit silly to cite Google Maps, when that map was created by a user ^{unless it wasn't, then it would be good to mention that}. Especially since every instance of that ref is coupled with this, which the map was presumably derived from. Probably just remove the Google Maps ref.
  • The map was created by me by tracing that map (it's the exact same data as used in the infobox map). and is simply to provide an interactive alternative to the simple line map in the report. I believe it merits inclusion, with the Aecom bulletin providing the validation that the map is correct. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• "Plan For The People". Ontario PC Party. Retrieved March 23, 2021. redirects to the homepage.
  • Fixed - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Every Yahoo ref is deadlinked (there are 3)
  • Stupid Yahoo, down after 4 months... fixed. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• What makes www.trucknews.com a WP:RS?
  • It's the online news arm of Today's Trucking magazine. Truckers like more highways :) - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Hunt, Geoff (July 12, 2001). "Council Minutes". Peelregion.ca. Regional Municipality of Peel. Retrieved April 7, 2018. is a deadlink.
  • This one doesn't surprise me... I copied it from another article and it's 3 years old. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)
• Is Building Highway 413 the Best Option for Moving People & Goods in the GTA West Region? (PDF) (Report). Environmental Defence. August 2020. Retrieved March 18, 2021.{{cite report}}: CS1 maint: url-status (link) is a deadlink PDF.
• Fixed
• What's up with bramptonguardian.com, yorkregion.com, and orangeville.com having the same exact website appearance? I'm assuming they are run by the same organization. (This isn't really a concern, just thought I would mention)
  • Yeah, all local subsidiaries of Metroland media (which used to print the free Metro newspaper in Toronto, but is now all digital).
• Especially because of the high amount of link rot I've seen, I'd highly recommend adding archive links to some of the sources, with priority to ones used twice / thrice.
  • Indeed. It's been 4 months since I nominated this so I'm not surprised there are deadlinks abound. There used to be a bot that would check the links and tag them, but alas. It may be fortuitous however, given the controversial nature of the topic and the tendency of participants in those skirmishes to randomly erase pages when they get one-upped by the opponent. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)

Images

I don't really find the first image that informative. Viewing the Highway 410 extension at such a (relatively) close angle doesn't really help conceptualize anything better. Especially since the highway is under construction, more map images would be useful for the route description section instead. The second image however, is a lot more useful.

For now it's a placeholder showing what may eventually become an abandoned section of highway. Perhaps soon I will do up a drawing of the massive interchange proposed at Highway 401/407. - Floydian ^τ _¢ 05:14, 10 July 2021 (UTC)