Talk:Gö Lotsawa Zhönnu-pel

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Not the same as 'gos khug pa lhas btsas!

The current version of this article has:

Gö Lotsawa Shyönnu Pal (1392-1481), 'Gos Khug-pa Lhas-btsas, Gö Kuk-ba-hlay-dzay, is also written as Khug-pa-Lhas-tsi, or simply 'Gos, was a famous Tibetan monk and translator (lotsawa).

He was born in the town of Tá-nag-phu in the province of Tsang. He travelled to India where he studied under 72 religious teachers. He learnt the sutras and mantras but was most interested in the Guhyasamaja Tantra which he assiduously promulgated in Tibet. The Guhyasamaja Tantra is considered to be, along with the Kalachakra Tantra and the Yamantaka Tantra, one of the 'Highest Yoga Tantras'.

His personal name was Lhas-btas ("Protected by gods"). His family name was 'Gos but, as his mother and father were both from the 'Gos family, he was often called 'Gos Khug-pa ("intermarried 'Gos"),

He was very critical of the 'Ancient Translation School' of the Nyingma.

He composed several commentaries on the Yamantaka Tantra and performed the ceremony of Yamantaka according to the Nyingma rites.

In the lineage of the Tibetan Panchen Lamas there were considered to be four Indian and three Tibetan incarnations of Amitabha Buddha before Khedrup Gelek Pelzang, who is recognised as the 1st Panchen Lama. The lineage starts with Subhuti, one of the original disciples of Gautama Buddha. Gö Lotsawa is considered to be the first Tibetan incarnation of Amitabha Buddha in this line.

— 2008-08-27

Please! This is mixing two entirely different people together - the 11th century 'gos khug pa lhas btsas, (TBRC P3458) a student of Atisha who was famously critical of the Nyingma tradition; and Gö Lotsawa ('gos lo ts'a ba gzhon nu dpal) ( b. 1392 d. 1481 ) TBRC P318 the famous author of the Blue Annals who was a student of the fifth Karmapa and Tsongkhapa - and a teacher if the 6th Karmapa

Gö Lotsawa's Blue Annals is cited as one of the sources for this article - and since Gö Lotsawa writes about the much earlier Gö Khugpa in that book, the mistake should have been obvious to anyone who had read it. Unfortunately this kind of sloppiness seems to plague the Tibetan Buddhism related articles on Wikipedia.

As it is, the article is currently in a real mess with statements about two entirely different figures mixed together. This needs to be untangled.

Chris Fynn (talk) 04:39, 27 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Dear Chris: I have just had a brief look at your notes and the article on Gö Lotsawa and it does look like you are right that I made a serious error last year when I combined information on the two men. I don't know yet how this happened, but the main thing is to correct the errors. I will do my best to sort the whole mess out over the next couple of days and will let you know when I have completed it so you can check the corrections or make any other suggestions you might have. So sorry for all the confusion. Oh, and thanks for picking up on the error - it will be good to get it all corrected! Sincerely, John Hill (talk) 09:43, 27 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Dear Chris: I have started on the rewrite of this article and also created a new one for Gö Khugpa. Please do have a look at them both - they are just beginnings - and please let me know if you have any comments or suggestions. Cheers and thanks, John Hill (talk) 17:14, 27 August 2008 (UTC)[reply]