Talk:Clement Freud

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Wife and Narnia

Okay, wife Jill Freud was the inspiration for C.S. Lewis's Lucy in Narnia. Who wants to do that? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.219.188.219 (talk) 02:49, 29 December 2005

First Jewish MP for decades?

What is the basis of this statement. Rotheschild, the MP-before-last of Freuds constituency was also Jewish. Epeeist smudge 15:41, 18 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Are we sure about his wife?

...By which I mean: "He married June Flewett (the inspiration for Lucy Pevensie in CS Lewis' children's series the Chronicles of Narnia)[1] in 1950, and the couple have five children." Because, I've just found an article that says:

Freud says he has omitted everything but the most 'uncontroversial happenings' from the text, and this is mostly true. But there are a few moments when indignation or irritation surge to the surface. In conversation, he is prepared to go further. In the book, for instance, he fudges his parents' non-appearance at his 1950 church wedding to actress Jill Raymond (who now runs two theatre companies in Suffolk). My interpretation had been that they had not been invited. But he corrects me on this. They were asked but chose, as atheists, not to attend.

Source:

The Observer, October 14, 2001

Review: Interview: The Freud who hates therapy: Sir Clement Freud despises the way he was brought up but his autobiography won't reveal any family secrets. In person, though, he talks about his brother Lucian, open marriage - and his passion for ping-pong

BYLINE: Harriet Lane

SECTION: Observer Review Pages, Pg. 3

Anyone know? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Oolon Colluphid (talk • contribs) 09:56, 21 May 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Wow, you have even weirder stuff than I do! I was just going to point out that he seemed to alternate through the article being married to "June" and "Jill"... Anyway, hopefully someone can provide some info. Bangdrum (talk) 13:07, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

IMDB says Jill (Jill Freud - Biography), and that her birth name was "June Beatrice Flewett". A cursory scan of google suggests she took the stage name "Jill Raymond" at some point. I'll leave it to you to find RS sources and add to article. :) -- Quiddity (talk) 19:19, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

How about this Telegraph bio-feature on Jill Freud? Bangdrum (talk) 02:44, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've made a brief go at it. It needs a rewrite for flow though (or her own article to move the Narnia and name-change facts into). I have no time - Go at it. -- Quiddity (talk) 16:15, 18 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Great anecdote I cannot verify

This was in "Life in politics" until just a moment ago:

Freud noticed that the Communist Chinese hosts regularly gave Churchill larger, or higher status, accommodation than him. Tactfully he enquired why and was told it was because of the status of Churchill's namesake. Freud observed that this was the first time ever that he had been 'out-grandfathered'.^{[citation needed]}

This is funny, and I tried to find a source, but I simply could not locate one. I am willing to do the research here to dig this out, but I am not sure where I would look, and the 2006 UK Who's Who is unlikely to include it, if what I know about Who's Whos is correct. If this came from a column then I will probably be unable to locate it, since I do not have access to any newspaper databases. Input would be greatly welcomed. --Ten Thousand Bullets (talk) 08:31, 21 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Freud gave a series of short talks on Radio 4, which included this anecdote. As I recall it, Freud pointed out that he had been an MP for longer than Churchill, was on more important committees and held a higher post in his party. He was told that it was because Churchill had a famous grandfather. Apepper (talk) 19:41, 20 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've seen him recount this on a Have I Got News For You episode that was at one point available on Youtube; it might be that searching for him (+ hignfy) there will give more exact details. 193.1.229.15 (talk) 17:30, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Need to very careful with Freud's 'anecdotes' as they could often be jokes or tall tales. --Ged UK 17:48, 16 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I've added a reference for this from The Times. --AdamSommerton (talk) 21:22, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

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Request for information on Clement Freud's horse race

I remember Clement Freud being in a well publicised horse race as part of a bet - not a friendly one either. I remember that he won the bet. Does anyone have any further details on this event? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ynda20 (talk • contribs) 18:09, 16 April 2009

"Freud once challenged Sir Hugh Fraser that he was the better horseman and beat him in a private race to win £1,000." Times obit Bangdrum (talk) 02:47, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Any source for the name of the horse being "Dig Up St Edmunds"? Martinevans123 (talk) 07:13, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

When I have time tonight, will run a LexisNexis search to see if there's any older press about this... Bangdrum (talk) 13:41, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Apparently: "He gave them names like Awesome Wells, Orpen wide, Eau Crikey or Dig-up St Edmunds - just to annoy the naming committee at the British Horseracing Authority", although the source for this, [1], seems to be just a blogsite. However, see also: [2] and the JAM transcript at [3]. 84.71.45.146 (talk) 16:28, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The horse in this race wasn't Dig Up St. Edmunds, he came later. Look:

"Freud's most famous racing triumph was beating then Harrods boss Sir Hugh Fraser in a match at Haydock on Winter Fair, who carried his colours to victory in the 1972 Waterloo Hurdle at Aintree.

Recalling the occasion, former trainer Toby Balding said: "That was typical of Clay. He was an enormous achiever and anything you could bet on caught his imagination, particularly in the competitive field.

"At that stage - it was before his journalistic career - he was a gourmet and was running restaurants and nightclubs, but he gave himself to me for three months, riding two or three lots a day, and honed himself down from 15st to 12st. We bought him Winter Fair and he had a large side stake on the result of the race - I think it was £1,000-a-side - and he then had quite a large bet on himself and got rewarding odds, because Sir Hugh, although not a jockey, was a riding, hunting, country gentleman. "I think everyone assumed Clay couldn't ride, but his attention to detail was absolutely immaculate in the way he got himself ready for the race. He actually hired a helicopter and flew over Haydock and then rode round the course on a horse we borrowed from George Owen. He won the race and, I think, in his own inimitable style, took a great deal of money out of the situation."

Balding added: "He was a unique man whom I admired enormously. He has made a great contribution to humour and to racing, and his column in the Racing Post was always a good read." Freud's relationship with his trainers was often turbulent, but one who enjoyed a long-term association was Michael Chapman, who said: "I couldn't understand why I lasted so long. I think it was because I never fell out with him. He would fall out with me, then we would be good friends the next time we met. "It was many years ago I met him at Market Rasen and gave him a winner, and then I saw him up at Cartmel at one of Lord Cavendish's lunches and gave him another winner, and the next thing was I got an order for a horse. "He had the most wonderful sense of humour. I can remember picking him up at the railway station in Newark once and he asked me how far it was to Market Rasen. Having told him, as the crow flies it was 25 miles, he suggested I pull into a lay-by to see if there were any crows.

"When he was an MP, his constituency included Bury St Edmunds and he bought a horse and sent the naming form off to call it Bury St Edmunds and they turned him down. He was so annoyed he called it Digup St Edmunds." The horse eventually ended up with Venetia Williams, who first met Freud when he was working on a Racing Post series in which he had breakfast with trainers.

So the horse's name would appear to be "Winter Fair." Source: Obit in the Racing Post, 4/17/09. Bangdrum (talk) 21:39, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Nice work Bangdrum. Assume that's Balding of Grand National teeth fame. Surely some of this needs to be fitted in. A sub-section on Freud the Horseman might be appropriate? Martinevans123 (talk) 21:53, 17 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

I see now that it was, in fact, veteran trainer Toby Balding (no relation). I have rearranged slightly and added a little more detail. I hope that's ok with you. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:11, 18 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Looks good to me. :) Bangdrum (talk) 15:50, 18 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

The view from Down Under

He appeared to be decidedly antipodophobic. Most unbecoming for a knight of the realm to be so utterly ungracious towards people who seemed to buy his books in large numbers and listen to Just a Minute in large numbers also. We need to round the man out by including this particular anti-antipodean foible, but where? -- ♬ Jack of Oz ♬ ^{[your turn]} 11:13, 31 May 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Four years on, his remark "In England, many men take sexual pleasures with women beneath their social station. As it must be difficult to find anyone beneath the social station of an Australian, you could be missing out on a lot of fun" suddenly doesn't sound quite so funny, for some reason. Martinevans123 (talk) 22:44, 14 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Madeleine McCann connection

According to the Freud family and the report on the Telegraph website, Clement Freud was not in Portugal when Madeleine McCann disappeared in 2007. Freud had a villa near where she was last seen, and was in contact with the McCanns subsequently. For the moment, this issue looks like a deeply unpleasant coincidence, rather than something really sinister, and thus insufficiently notable for inclusion. Other editors may disagree, so to try to prevent a possible edit war, I think this aspect of the media coverage should be opened up for discussion. Philip Cross (talk) 11:12, 15 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Tend to agree. Perhaps this will be examined more closely in the ITV documentary to be broadcast tonight. Martinevans123 (talk) 11:26, 15 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Allegations of historical child sexual abuse

Should these be mentioned in the opening section? Martinevans123 (talk) 22:21, 18 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

The problem was that the lead section was far too short - one sentence. That gives the allegations undue weight if they are included there. If the introductory section were expanded to two or three paragraphs, it may then be appropriate to include a reference to the allegations. Ghmyrtle (talk) 08:03, 19 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

PS: I've now expanded it slightly, and trimmed the reference to the allegations. Ghmyrtle (talk) 08:13, 19 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

I can see there's been no discussion of this for quite some time. I've add "alleged" to the lead, as just saying he was a "child abuser" implies he either admitted it at some point or was convicted. Personally I think any mention is unnecessary in the first sentence of the lead, because it then follows on in the final part of the lead to talk about the allegations made after this death. What we have is duplication for no good reason. That said I don't feel particularly strongly, so won't make any changes for a while - I may even forget to come back to the page! John Smith's (talk) 21:54, 6 June 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Army career

During the war Freud joined the Royal Ulster Rifles and served in the ranks. He acted as an aide to Field Marshal Montgomery. He worked at the Nuremberg Trials and in 1947 was commissioned as an officer.

He couldn't have served as an aide to Monty before being commissioned. What was the actual sequence of his rankings and postings? Valetude (talk) 15:14, 19 March 2017 (UTC)[reply]

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