Talk:Cincinnati/Archive 1

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Missing Historical Facts

There was previously a large paragragh detailing important historical information about Cincinnati. This included The first Jewish hospital, the first municipal fire department, pre-prohibition brewing, King (Queen) Records, and more. Any reason why this relevant information was deleted? —the preceding unsigned comment is by 152.163.100.70 13:00, 31 December 2005 (talk • contribs)

Probably because the article is getting too large and the information is in History of Cincinnati, Ohio. CambridgeBayWeather (Talk) 21:05, 31 December 2005 (UTC)

Clean-up

While merging Fountain Square, I did a substantial revision of the opening and early history as well as some of the rather extensive lists. I am very tempted to just delete the "notable" people. Cincy is a big city; there are lots of famous people who were born there, raised there, or live there now. --Tysto 20:12, 2005 August 10 (UTC)

Why delete the list? Create another article like other cities have? Famous Cincinnatians or whatever. Please keep part of the list because some people should be noted right? JoeHenzi 07:49, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

Oh wait, you already deleted it... good job. Hey good idea to list all of the companies with HQ's in Cincinnati though. Totally retarded if you ask me. Why delete the information? Why not just move it to another page and preserve it? JoeHenzi 07:51, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

Trying to fix the table at the end of the article. Someone added a theatre link, which then converted the rest of the article into a part of this table. Does anyone know how to fix this? Sorry. Theguyinblue 08:50, 17 Aug 2006

Merge Fountain Square?

There is a proposal to merge the Cincy part of the article Fountain Square with this one. I disagree and have described my reasons on its discussion page. --Tysto 13:05, 2005 August 4 (UTC)

• Consensus was to merge Fountain Square info with respective articles and create a generic fountain square article. --Tysto 20:12, 2005 August 10 (UTC)

Factual errors

As a 45-years resident of Cincinnati, I thought I'd look at this page and see if I could be helpful in editing/augmenting it. There do seem to be a few small but clear errors in it:

• Cincinnati is not the home of General Electric -- although a major divison of GE is housed here (the Jet Engines), and the current CEO of GE was raised here (in a suburb called Finneytown).

• Several of the "notable people from Cincinnati" really don't come from here, at least not in the sense that they lived any significant time in the metropolitan area. Neither Clooney (Rosie or George) lived here. Their family home was Maysville, KY, a long way from the metro Cincinnati area. President Grant never lived here (was born in Point Pleasant, many miles east, and grew up in Georgetown, just as far east).

Hope this is useful.

Lastime

You are correct, and I've made these and some other adjustments. I hope you come back again. Lou I 09:24, 22 Mar 2004 (UTC)

More "native" revisions...Jerry Springer, born in Germany, moved to NYC at age five, moved here after law school. Oscar Robertson, born in Indianapolis, played at Crispus Attucks HS there, moved to Cincinnati to play for UC. Lad liam 04:27, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

---

To Mav: I also restored the Introduction heading. The value is that it moves the Table of Contents high enough to be useful. Now, if we just had another, smaller picture to go beside it (sigh),,, Lou I

When noting who hails from this great ciy please keep in mind that they never had to live in "Cincinnati proper"... meaning Maysville, KY is too far but Finneytown is ok (I'd assume). If someone comes from Norwood, I'd add them here and there are the two are close enough geographically. Anyone wish to comment? (For example, I kept off Nick Lachey because he never lived here from what I can tell - although he did go to SCPA? - I'm confused.)JoeHenzi 00:21, 27 Aug 2004 (UTC)

Porkopolis

I am having trouble with this sentence:

"Like Chicago, Cincinnati started as a massive agricultural center, and was rudely ridiculed as Porkopolis by Mrs. Trollope in her book on Americans' manners, who gained revenge after her salon failed."

Namely:

1) Did Frances Trollope use the term "Porkopolis" in Domestic Manners of the Americans? I think it was in use before her book, and I haven't confirmed that she used the term.

2) I can't seem to make sense of the last phrase about revenge: Trollope had a salon? Revenge for what?

I intend to pursue these issues, but I wanted to see if anyone had comments.

Thanks,

Rdikeman 15:32, Apr 6, 2004 (UTC)

Please, by all means find out the truth and set the article straight. (As above it's noted that many of these people aren't from Cincinnati)

No -- Mrs. Trollope never used the term Porkopolis. She wrote about the pigs roaming free in the streets of Cincinnati, but the name Porkopolis came from a papier mache pig sent to a Cincinnati pork packer by a London banker. Painted on the pig was the phrase "To the Mayor of Porkopolis."

And -- Mrs. Trollope's salon did not fail. Her Bazaar (a shop) failed. OKF

Names of Cincinnati's Seven Hills & Origin of Its Queen City Name

From time to time, Cincinnati newspapers publish articles about the names of Cincinnati's seven hills and the origin of its Queen City name. The information is invariably misleading, or inadequate at best.

The seven hills are fully described in the June, 1853 edition of the West American Review, "Article III -- Cincinnati: Its Relations to the West and South." The hills form a crescent from the east bank of the Ohio River to the west bank: Mount Adams, Walnut Hills, Mount Auburn, Vine-street Hill, Fairmont, Mount Harrison and College Hill.

I do not know the text of the article you are referring to above, but Fairmont is actually Fairmount in the naming scheme today. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.62.16.218 (talk • contribs)

The spelling in the article is "Fairmont".RME

Cincinnati was first described as a queen by the Inquisitor and Cincinnati Advertiser on May 4, 1819, page 3, column 1. The language used is similar to the description of Babylon, an allegory for ancient Rome, in the book of Revelation.

Thus, Cincinnati has a double connection to the pagan Roman Empire: the queen designation and the seven hills. This information was provided some years ago to the Cincinnati Public Library by the Church of Ouzo, but it was never properly communicated to the public. The newspaper article is on microfilm at the library, and the West American Review can be found in the Rare Books department. -- Robert Merlin Evenson/Church of Ouzo

Thank you for your research, but this is not appropriate to the article. Many cities are given lofty nicknames with vaguely classical connections just as many buildings are given neo-classical architecture. --Tysto 13:05, 2005 August 4 (UTC)

What is not appropriate, the information, or my interpretation? RME

If the names of the hills surrounding the city are of local interest, then there's good reason to include them, but it is my understanding that there are really more than seven and that the lofty nickname is just a poetic allusion to ancient Rome--just like the name Cincinnati itself [1]. Your connection by way of Revelations--which is certainly not what the original writer intended--to the "pagan Roman Empire" is specious reasoning and original research, which does not belong in an encyclopedia. --Tysto 17:30, 2005 August 5 (UTC)

I find it difficult to believe that Cincinnati became the City of Seven Hills simply because there were a multitude of hills in the area. The reference I cited is about seven specific hills that form a crescent encircling the city, which I feel presents a far more compelling argument. The fact that Cincinnati was named after a Roman dictator actually enhances its symbolic connection to ancient Rome. Furthermore, an allegorical interpretation can hardly be considered specious reasoning, especially since this is a discussion section, apart from the article itself. RME

Again, naming the several hills surrounding Cincinnati is appropriate. Equating the nickname "Queen City" with the biblical Whore of Babylon is original research, which is not appropriate to an encyclopedia: Wikipedia:No original research. --Tysto 23:57, 2005 August 8 (UTC)

Again, this is a discussion section, not the article itself. RME

The talk page is here to talk about the article and how to improve it. Peyna 18:18, 4 February 2006 (UTC)

Not only am I talking about the article, but enhancing it. RME

Seven Hills is kind of a misnomer. If one views the region from the Carew Tower, the area north of the river is quite flat with lots of valleys. The last glacial age leveled the landscape; the melt then eroded out the valleys...Mill, Deer and Duck Creeks, Little Miami River, etc. which give the impression of hills. The course of the Ohio River was defined by the runoff. Looking south into Kentucky, one can see that the topography there has not been flattened by glacial activity. Lad liam 04:12, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

It was not a misnomer in 1853 when the seven hills were described in detail in the West American Review. And it wasn't done from the vantage point of the Carew Tower. Furthermore, the seven hills are also allegorical, like P&G's moon-and-stars logo which is discussed in the article on Procter & Gamble.RME

Added a section about Race Relations

As Cincy has been noted for its current state & was often cited as an important place for the URail. --Duemellon 13:36, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Readded the link to the 2001 Cincinnati Riots. There is an article for it. --Duemellon 12:00, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

User at 207.69.138.204 (and I assume 207.69.138.200) removed the link to the valid 2001 Cincinnati Riots article & further removed the subtopic heading of "race relations". I invite them to discuss their decision to do so to avoid an edit war. When it comes to politics the subject of race relations for Cincy is very relevent & instead of injecting the entirety of the riot's article it is best to put a mention of it & a link. Please join in a discussion before you go back through & remove the link & information. I also see that it is very selective as you have left the statement about the deadly riot that took place after MLKjr's death. This increases the perception that your activity is suspicious because of the edit-war going on by you in the riot's article (and the vandalism you participated in by blanking it out yesterday). Please stop the edit war & join in a discussion. --Duemellon 12:47, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

re-readded the link to the riots with this text:

After the shooting of an unarmed 19-year old Black male (Timothy Thomas) by Officer Steven Roach during an on-foot pursuit while a trial accusing the city's police deparement of Racial Profiling was taking place sparked the 2001 Cincinnati Riots. --Duemellon 13:08, 24 August 2005 (UTC)

It's great that we've started a race relations section - but could it be a little more factual? The first part is entirely a run on sentence that can be made into at least two (I'll try now) and it leaves out a lot of history. It wasn't just Timothy Thomas that started those riots, it was also the death of Roger Owensby (Jr?) - within like two weeks three black men died at the hands of the police. The third was in fact threatening an officer and made a "move" on him. These three deaths, the history of the relationship between police and citizens and city counsel, the way police and city council responded to public outcry, and the death of two innocent men (Thomas and Owensby) at the hands of police all caused the firestorm. Don't bother trying to say that the police were wrong or right. I have a very strong opinion on this topic, but those who disagree with me stand a lot stronger. They will ruin this article if we get to close to saying that Owensby or Thomas shouldn't have died, as I believe (Especially Owensby, I personally think he was murdered by the police where Thomas was mistakenly killed). We must only put the facts in this article. JoeHenzi 08:04, 11 September 2005 (UTC)

I appreciate your view but I did go through & create the 2001 Cincinnati Riots article to delve deeply into that topic. Whereas this incident appears almost like a footnote in this piece about Cincinnati, the article about the riots is even bigger. If you feel it requires more of a highlight in this article, what do you suggest that wouldn't be redundant to the riot's main article? How can we do it to make sure that the riot doesn't overshadow the rest of Cincinnati's storied history & is displayed in a proper manner? Race relations here suck, bad, but when I tried to show it better here it got stomped. Instead of just putting "they're bad" what can we do to better highlight the shame of the Ohio Valley in a way that puts it in proper context? --Duemellon 16:28, 28 November 2005 (UTC)

Re-edited the section as it was a bit misleading. The original was worded in a way that suggested the lawsuit came about after the shooting of Timothy Thomas, which it did not. The lawsuit's intent was changed after that. Also headed that paragraph emphasizing there is a separate article for the riots as well as adding a bit to the details. --Duemellon 16:04, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

Readded the statement about the post-MLKjr assassination riot that took place in Cincy that killed 2. Not sure why it was taken out & if you feel it shouldn't be here please discuss. --Duemellon 17:52, 9 December 2005 (UTC)

The section about "Race Relations" was reduced and cropped by someone who did not mention their reasoning. Readded with new research. Please talk about your reasons for deletion before or when you do it again. Edit wars r teh suX0r --Duemellon 14:41, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

It took a little of work, but it was removed 15:58, December 13, 2005 by User:24.165.115.74 who has made some other edits to mostly Ohio pages and mostly harmless, so it's hard to judge what happened or how it managed to get by so many editors. Peyna 16:43, 26 January 2006 (UTC)

Removed the statement about it being "generally a safe haven for runaways" as being too simplistic & inserted in an abrupt fashion. I think there may be some room to add a comment like that, but it so strongly contradicts what was said before it makes that section appear confused or contradictory. If you could provide linkage & that section expands, it should be it's own article so readers can compare the incidents. As the history i've encountered, as much as Cinti was a goal for runaways, it was also one of the most dangerous places for them to be as well due to everyone KNOWING it was a goal. --Duemellon 15:02, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

cleaned up the added comments in the race riots section as some where inappropriately placed & the sentences were fragmented. One statement was at the end about how all police involved were acquitted, which was not only unnecessary, it is inaccurate. Removed the "misplaced distrust" as that is an opinion. Removed the "criminal" comments as some of the 15 were being sought/confined by police & not all of their "criminal" status was proven by a court of law or pursued. Comments like those suggest an attempt to dampen or bias that section to absolve the city or CPD whereas all teh information in there currently is factual & pretty dry. If you do not agree please discuss. --Duemellon 00:51, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

HACKED to pieces? Okay, so someone out there feels the section about race riots is a bit harsh, but I challenge you to find inaccuracies in what is given or specify bias. Simply adding in false statements, incidental notes, and selectively removing race notations, might make you feel better but is certifiably inaccurate. So please, if these things are true please share your source so we may include both sources for the reader to independently compare.

examples of skewing the meaning by user at IP 72.49.43.245 :

• Selectively removing race notations. In 1829 the Whites began the riots with the intent to terrorize the Blacks, this is well documented in linkage provided as well as any Cinti historian worth their title. The editor 72.49.43.245 removed that it was White people who rioted & therefore leaves out the race aspect even though it was a race riot.

• Stating the pro-slavery riot "served to strengthen" the abolitionist movement is undefinsible as well as detrimental to the known aspect that Cinti wasn't as safe of a safe-haven it was touted for runaways.

• It's suspicious that all the comments about "Whites" being rioters were removed but the "Irish" description remained almost intact except for the removal of the Black community resisting the White rioters' attempt to attack the Black residential areas (which was readded).

• Removing the racial descriptor that the deadliest US riot was started by a White mob seems odd when considering the note that Blacks rioted in 1967, 68 & 01 remained intact. Furthermore, although one could infer it was a White mob that started the riot because in 1967 was the FIRST riot started by Blacks, it would clarify some things by including it. Also, consider that the editor at 72.49.43.245 remvoed the statement that 1967 was the 1st riot initiated by Blacks which further misleads the reader.

• In the 2001 blurb there were the comments that it was "misplaced distrust" which is assumption, that the 15 were Black "criminals" which isn't true (as many never made it trial and didn't have a current outlaw/wanted status by the police), and the notation that all police involved were acquitted is not only unnecessary but inaccurate.

In addition, another editor 63.210.237.190 included further inaccuracy:

• Stated the boycott "has been lifted" which is not true, as the parties who initiated the boycott have been recorded as saying the boycott is being called for

--Duemellon 01:33, 24 February 2006 (UTC)

I question why "Race Riots" are even given a special section to begin with. Certainly racial tension exists in most major cities, and usually on a much larger scale (i.e.: Los Angeles, which does not have a special riot section). I'm not belittling the significance of these events, and they are certainly newsworthy and historical. However, it paints an unjustified negative picture of the city. They should not be listed as if they are a routine occurence.

Race relations is a current issue in the City. It is often talked about by the politicians & news. It comes up every election. The riots are mentioned every year. Cries of racism echo through the streets. To suggest they are not routine is to turn a blind eye to the facts of the disparity. BEYOND THAT... there are significant nationally-recognized events which took place that specifically highlighted the race issue in Cincy. Even if it was a temporary event, there are many temporary events mentioned in the article. How can someone justify putting in the slave/free state border but skip the riots that occurred? This is NOT a travel brochure, this is an article of events which Cincy is famous for. Cincinnati is famous for it's race riot in 2001. The racial tensions here are palpable & mentioned often as a dynamic sociopolitical issue. --Duemellon 02:48, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

There's no disputing that race relations are an issue in Cincinnati, again, just like they are in every other medium to large city. Riots are most certainly NOT routine, and the list as it appears is like a forecast for the next solar eclipse. There is certainly an acknowledgement among local politicians that racial tension is an issue, but violence and misdirected hostility is perpetuated hatred by both whites and blacks. Racial harmony is the goal of any civil-minded, responsible individual. There was no specific mention of the riots in the recent Mayoral election. There's also no suggestion here to skip the inclusion of these events...but if important sociopolitical issues are to be included, why not include what should be the most important: Death in the streets of Cincy. The biggest tragedy is how so many lives are ending in the streets. In only the last three years, 17 people have died, just in Over-The-Rhine alone. Now add the surrounding neighborhoods. Now add a few more years on to the last three. What's the biggest problem in Cincinnati right now? Genocide.

I'm sorry, did you say genocide? Most of the murders in Cincinnati have more to drugs, money and sex than race, ethnicity or religion. No one is trying to exterminate another groups of people entirely. Be careful with your hyperboles, you might end up marginalizing a real genocide. Peyna 02:30, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

My point? MOST murders in Cincinnati are being committed by my own people. It doesn't matter if one is involved in illegal activities. If we're in the way of those abundant actions, the numbers (which continue to go up) say I'm likely to be killed at the hands of a relative than from a riot. There are thugs in those streets that could care less about you, me, or a productive discussion. Bullets are hitting babies, intentionally and unintentionally. When there's no remorse from shooters who enjoy the intimidation they apply, then yes, even if on a comparitively small scale, genocide is an appropriate word.

So, in your own words: "There's also no suggestion here to skip the inclusion of these events... but if important sociopolitical issues are to be included, why not include what should be the most important: Death in the streets of Cincy." Did u happen to read: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Cincinnati%2C_Ohio#Crime.2FLegal that addition? Please do. I was planning to, but I didn't. There's no need to "remove" b/c ur concern wasn't included. This is text... u won't run out of room by adding. So please do.

As for "racial issues" being a big issue throughout the US, yah, u'r right, but when was the last time Black & White racial tensions in Rhode Island made national headlines? or the shooting of an unarmed Black man was reported in Hawaii? Also, considering, where is the crossreferencing link to all teh cities to the big racial prob? This detail fits. Please add yours. --Duemellon 17:13, 6 May 2006 (UTC) --Duemellon 01:39, 31 May 2006 (UTC) Someone removed the line that only black males were killed & no other ethnicities during that span. I guess the truth is too embarassing for them? Then went on to state that all the dead Black males were "criminals" which is easily provable otherwise. There were several who were never charged with anything & were never criminals. The end statement that supports called & call it an "uprising" is a fact which they removed & replaced it with a statement that the people who did it were "actually" hurt by it. If you there was some validity to your statement & it wasn't just some attempt to rewrite history/w a more biased view, please join the discussion.

Removed the statement about there being "non-segrated" areas which was injected immediately after the sentence stating: There are areas of high integration, as being redundant. Removed the statement about the financial class segregation between East & West as being placed in the wrong heading (the heading is about Race Relations, not segregation in general) --Duemellon 12:46, 13 June 2006 (UTC)

History of the name

What is the specific history for the name Cincinnati? I heard it was from some Roman general's name or whatever. Could someone explain that & why it was chose for Cincy? --Duemellon 13:36, 22 August 2005 (UTC)

Paragraph two of the History section explains this in some detail. --Tysto 07:28, 2005 September 5 (UTC)

Online Media

I have added an online media section, as I noted the need for it in--or was inspired by--the post [User_talk:IndependentEye]. As such, I moved Cincinnati Nation from the Print section to the Online section, as it doesn't appear to have a print edition. Please help work on this section, and we can build it up. Westsideman. 12 Nov 2005

Neil Armstrong, Cincinnati native?

I removed Neil Armstrong from the Famous Cincinnati Natives section, as he is neither from Cincinnati originally (he was born near Wapakoneta, Ohio, about two hours north of Cincinnati), nor does he live in Cincinnati now (he lives in Lebanon, Ohio -- this could perhaps be considered the greater Cincinnati area, but as it's not even in the same county as Cincinnati, it seems a stretch to say he's a Cincinnati native). Feel free to reinstate him on the list if you're privy to information I'm not (be sure to add it to the Neil Armstrong page, as well). AnDrew McKenzie 23:15, 20 November 2005 (UTC)

- Yeap, he is a native of the Greater Cincinnati area. Lebanon (Warren County, Ohio) is generally considered to be in the greater Cincinnati area, in fact he works at the University of Cincinnati...--Bgrubbs 00:58, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

That's quite a stretch. What's next, Cincinnati claims the Wright Brothers? For what it's worth, Lebanon is 25.9 miles by road from the downtown Dayton and 31.9 to downtown Cincinnati. I think it's a bit much to place Lebanon in the metropolitan area of either city. There is quite a bit of "blank space" between Lebanon and Cincy. Peyna 01:15, 3 February 2006 (UTC)

Lebanon is in the Cincinnati Metro area... just as montgomery or Mason is.... The Cincinnati Metro Area is made up of a few counties... not just Hamilton.

According to the census 2000 data, Lebanon (all of Warren County) is in the Cincinnati PMSA. The Cincinnati CMSA contains both the Cincinnati PMSA and the Hamilton-Middletown PMSA. And yes, Lebanon is closer to Dayton, but Dayton is a much smaller (rougly 50%) CMSA than Cincinnati. In fact, it is predicted that Dayton will be part of the "Greater Cincinnati" CMSA by 2010 or 2020, similar to how Akron is connected to Cleveland. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.62.16.218 (talk • contribs)

Marge Schott

Hey folks. I'd encourage anybody with an interest in this lady to pop on over to her article. It needs a bit of cleanup -- currently, practically every sentence starts with a date (i.e. On February 2, blah blah blah happened). · Katefan0^(scribble) 16:19, 30 November 2005 (UTC)

Metro politics

Doesn't Cincinnati's suburbs have a reputation for being very conservative in comparison to other American suburban areas? Someone please incorporate that, including into the topic of race relations. -Amit

That's an understatement, especially looking at the northern suburbs. Also, the city (within the city limits) has a reputation for being highly Democrat-leaning and progressive leading way back to the Boss Cox era. This regional polarization results in many battles between districts and power struggles between city and county officials. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.62.16.218 (talk • contribs)

2001 Riots -- How Many Days?

Could we get more specific in the number of days protesting and rioting lasted? "After a few days of protests at City Hall, riots broke out that lasted a few days." —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Candybars (talk • contribs) .

See the main article for additional details. --Duemellon 14:59, 23 February 2006 (UTC)

East Side / West Side

The Neighborhoods section states, "There are an assortment of classifications, but the separations only help to unite the city more." This sounds a little odd, and a bit point of view. If this sentence is kept, perhaps we need to provide a more complete explanation of how these distinctions "unite the city more", because the previous sentence, which quotes stereotypes commonly used to describe each side of town, doesn't sound very uniting. – Minh Nguyễn (talk, contribs) 04:50, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

There's someone coming to the Cinti page & trying to "charm" it up... u'kno? Like hide the racial issues, downplay rivalries, or ignore the population loss & crime. They're pretty clumsy at it & the sentences often end up tagged with a "but" or "and" and a short statement that contradicts or deflects the previous possible sore-spot. Iwonder if they work for our Chamber of Commerce or something. Heck, maybe it's what Luken does now that he's out of a job. Charlie! Why don't you say HI!!!?!?!?! --Duemellon 19:27, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

The East-Side / West-Side "battle" pre-dates I-75 and is rooted in Vine St. as being the dividing line. This is evident in the street naming convention for the "old town" where the East/West naming is preserved. In addition, all of the numeric addresses are numbered going out (east and west) from Vine St. It was further fueled when neighborhoods such as Mt. Adams and Price Hill poked up and started to carve out their own internal identities. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.62.16.218 (talk • contribs)

Oh! Come on! Nearly every city west of the colonial eastern seaboard has numeric addresses going in tow directions from a central line, with streets identified as east and west of that line (or north and south). Vine Street just happens to be that central line for Cincinnati. This has nothing to do with an east-west rivalry or battle, it was just a convenient naming and numbering process selected by early city planners back when most people walked to their destinations. Pzavon 01:51, 21 June 2006 (UTC)

The point is not that it is the symptom. The vine street divider has been prominent in the east/west discussion though. Jim Tarbell recently referred to this divider during a television peice about Over-the-Rhine. 66.117.224.249 05:04, 9 July 2006 (UTC) (C. Kane)

Crime/Legal

Gonna add a section about crime soon (in a week or so, I plan). After Politics. If someone has a better title for it than Legal System & Crime, or wahtever, please share. Also, if anyone has a good format to consider, that'd be great. --Duemellon 19:31, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

How about "Crime in the Cincity" I know alot of people who use that name for cincinnati. Some live there and some don't, but I've heard that nickname more than any other.

-Just an idea.--Heltemes 19:31, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

As an article section it's probably not an appropriate name; but feel free to add something to the nicknames section. Peyna 16:41, 5 August 2006 (UTC)

Civil War Question

Since when was ohio considered a border state? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.166.240.19 (talk • contribs) .

Perhaps you misread the paragraph you seem to be referring to? It says Ohio was across the Ohio River from Kentucky, a border state (and a slave state). A lot of slaves tried to escape by swimming (or running, in the winter) across the river. Peyna 02:52, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

well, technically OH is border state when considering Canada. However, I doubt anyone would refer to it as such. --Duemellon 00:23, 11 March 2006 (UTC)

Cultural Life missing some items

I'm surprised that the Cincinnati Symphony Orchestra, the May Festival (and Chorus) and Music Hall haven't been included. As well, the University's College-Conservatory of Music is one of the leading schools for training in musical theater, jazz, classical, and operatic music. The mostly free public performances, several every week, are the best value in town.Lad liam 04:46, 10 March 2006 (UTC)

We already had articles about the CSO and CCM, so I added them under the "Culture" section. We don't yet have an article about the May Festival. I've added a link to Music Hall (Cincinnati) under the already-included photo of Music Hall. – Minh Nguyễn (talk, contribs) 04:27, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

Race Riots

How are Irish not Whites & Whites not Irish. Aren't the terms indistinguishable when considering the greater introduction of the "Race Riot" section highlighting the tensions between Whites & Blacks? Are the Whites disowning us Irish folk? --Duemellon 05:47, 12 March 2006 (UTC)

Uhm. GoldSlur how's about a discussion. I returned it back to say Irish & also White, please explain why there is a distinction? Irish are White people unless they are the 1st generation immigrants or just working here w/o citizenship... right?

Someone removed the 1967 riots without explanation. Is/was there a reason? --Duemellon 13:01, 26 March 2006 (UTC)

The Big Onion?

I have never heard Cincinnati referred to as "The Big Onion." Perhaps it is a major nickname that I've never heard, but if not, should it really be wasting space at that already crowded first paragraph? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Candybars (talk • contribs) 10:14, 27 March 2006 (UTC)

I wondered the same thing, though it makes me chuckle that the city would be called an "onion". I have a feeling it's more an obscure answer to New York's "Big Apple" nickname than a widely-known moniker. – Minh Nguyễn (talk, contribs) 04:20, 17 April 2006 (UTC)

The "Nasty"

Yes, I've heard this used. Someone has added that nickname a few times & others removed it. It is sometimes called "The Nasty/Nasti" or "Nasty Nati". The derrogatory connotation is contextual to the usage as "nasty" itself can mean several things. --Duemellon 17:15, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

Someone re-removed it. So I readded it. If you have a problem with it please discuss. --Duemellon 23:46, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

I've not heard it used; could you perhaps site a few references for the nickname that demonstrate it is more than a neologism and it at least somewhat wide use? Peyna 02:04, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

There are several local rap artists using it. There have been many shirts printed with it. However, all you need to do is go to Google & type it & you'll see how widely it is being used in the AfroAmer community. With so many sites using it, which one should I provide as a source? There are shops listed in the Google search for stores that sell the printed shirts too. One that sold it (it was on a Bengals tied-in shirt) is a sponsored link. --Duemellon 23:11, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

Personally I don't think it's notable enough, at least not important enough to be in the introduction. In fact, probably none of the nicknames, except maybe "Queen City" belong in the intro. The others can all be covered elsewhere. You'll notice other major cities do the same. Usually alternative names listed in the introduction are of the type that a user might search for or actually think is the real name of the thing. Peyna 23:58, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

I can agree those nicknames that are not known so well could be put somewhere else, however, I think it's important to include the "Nasty/Nasti" nickname in the other area created. Personally, Cincy, Cinti (written, not spoken), & Queen City are the most common names I've heard of the place outside of Cincy. --Duemellon 01:40, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Done. This also provides with an excellent place within the article to elaborate on the origins of these nicknames, which can provide the reader with additional insight regarding the city and its people and reputation. Peyna 02:15, 19 June 2006 (UTC)