Talk:Alfonso VI of León and Castile

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article title

should this not be Alfonso VI of Leon, particilarly if his father is kept at Ferdinand I of Leon???? 62.78.104.129 15:53, 21 June 2005 (UTC)[reply]

the emperator totius hispanae) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.177.180.206 (talk) 05:24, 19 February 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Sagrajas??

Why doesnt this article mention anything about his defeat at Sagrajas (arabic: al-zalaqa)??! Could anyone with some good sources write something up please. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 213.189.93.13 (talk) 18:30, 24 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Agnes of Aquitaine

This page claims she was divorced from Alfonso due to consanguinity. In all my readings about Alfonso they state she died in 1078, while still married to the king. Both Cowdrey (Pope Gregory VII, chapter entitled Christian Spain, page 477) and Pidal (The Cid and his Spain, 147) hold this position.

I may make the correction unless someone has any concerns.Avid Historiographer 23:06, 10 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

There is a papal letter, imprecisely dated but about 1080, which accuses Alfonso of being in an incestuous marriage (a marriage to someone related within a degree prohibited by the church). Chronicler Orderic Vitalis writes that Helias, Count of Maine, decades later, married Agnes, formerly wife of Alfonso VI. These have been interpreted as indicating that Alfonso divorced Agnes as a result of the papal opinion and she later remarried. However, there are alternative interpretations of both items. Orderic might have been confused, either in terms of which of the numerous Agnes of Aquitaines Helias married, or with regard to which former wife of Alfonso he married (e.g. Beatrice, Alfonso's widow - it would certainly be unusual for Agnes to disappear for decades, and only then remarry, although an unreported marriage in between is not out of the question). Likewise, the letter from the pope could refer to his imprecisely dated marriage to Constance of Burgundy (she being a second cousin of first wife Agnes, and hence within the prohibited degree of affinity).

There is a death record for a Queen Agnes, dated ~~1087~~ 1097, in a late source. This has been taken by some to be an erroneous reversal of ~~1078~~ 1079, her "true" death date by authors prefering a death hypothesis, or accurate by those prefering the divorce scenario (although this is before she could have married Helias). However, both interpretations appear to be wrong, as this is certainly Agnes of Aquitaine, Queen of Aragon, rather than her sister of the same name. It should probably be ambiguated, but with care to appropriately represent the uncertainty: an uncertainly that applies to the entire issue of Alfonso's spouses, virtually every source giving a different account (see, for example, Reilly's "The Kingdom of Leon-Castile Under Alfonso VI"; Canal Sanchez-Pagin in "Anuario de Estudios Medievales", 21:11-40; Palencia in "Estudios Sobre Alfonso VI y la Reconquista de Toledo".)Agricolae 16:10, 21 March 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Making this even more confusing, both of these Agnes's are daughters of Guillaume VIII, Duke of Aquitaine, though by two different wives. The Agnes that was Queen of Aragon died in 1097. 69.42.36.230 (talk) 07:31, 16 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, typo on my part, now fixed with strikethroughs. Agricolae (talk) 01:20, 18 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

While we're on the subject of Alfonso's marriages, can anyone cite a reference for the story that he was betrothed to Agatha of Normandy (William the Conqueror's daughter), but that Agatha died before the marriage took place? Weir's British Royal Family genealogy shows Agatha and Alfonso's marriage taking place before 1074 at Abbey of the Holy Trinity, Caen, Normandy, France. I can find nothing to confirm this, but I can find no confirmation that Agatha died either. Agatha has also been known as Elgiva of Normandie. 69.42.36.230 (talk) 07:31, 16 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I think this is originally from Orderic, and if I recall correctly, he is explicit in calling it a betrothal, not a marriage, and states that Agatha was to be taken to Iberia for the marriage. For an overview of what is available, do a Google Books search for Orderic and "Amfurcius" (i.e. Alfonso). Agricolae (talk) 01:20, 18 December 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Error in bottom table

In the table it states that he was preced as king of leon by his brother Sancho II wich is incorrect as the beginning of this biography clearly states that he inherited Leon in 1065 straight from his father Ferdinand I. Could someone please correct this? I'm not so good with those tables 81.165.123.84 07:56, 2 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

It is correct as it stands. Note that Leon appears twice. Alfonso's first reign was in succession to his father, but came to an end when he was ejected by his brother Sancho. He then regained the crown following Sancho's assassination. I will clarify. Agricolae 05:40, 4 April 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Really bad article

Let's have some information about his conquest or liberation of Toledo, his attempt to negotiate with the Muslim Taifas, his self-proclaimed title of "Protector of All Religions" -- and the bloody murder of his Jewish ambassador. What happened? This article is all about legend and poetry. Scott Adler (talk) 10:01, 7 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Please fix

FIX THIS ARTICLE PLEASE..it is an embarrassment..

The article is just awful, mixing mythology with bad translation errors. There is an excellent biography by Bernard Reilly that will tell you everything, in more detail than you ever dreams possible.

Ferdinand I divided his united realm among his sons. Alfonso, who received Leon, tried to defeat his brother Sancho, king of Castile. Alfonso was sent into exile, to the city of al Ma'mun of Toledo, his feudal client. From there he might have plotted his brother's murder (it is not known). He likely financed the beginning of the construction of the cathedral of Santiago de Compostela, Under pressure form Abbot Hugh of Cluny and Pope Gregory VII, he worked to reform the indigenous "Mozarabic" church of the Iberian peninsula, compelling them to accept the Roman liturgy. This caused considerable consternation in the Spanish church. As king of Leon and Castile, he maneuvered the takeover of Toledo in 1085 (it was a diplomatic..not really a military action), and ushered in an era in which Castilians interacted intimately with Muslims and Jews in former Taifa cities.

His only son was born to a Muslim concubine, Zaida, who was the daughter-in-law of a king. It is thought that Alfonso married her and that she became his wife Elizabeth. The son, Sancho, was killed in battle against the Almoravids, and his daughter, Urracca, was made queen. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Urraccarules (talk • contribs) 20:29, 12 April 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move

See the rationale, and related moves, at Talk:Ferdinand I of León#Requested move. Srnec (talk) 05:49, 1 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Done –Drilnoth (T • C) 19:41, 5 March 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Cinematic portrayal

His portrayal by John Fraser in the 1966 epic "El Cid" needs mention in the "In Popular Culture" section.... — Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.26.169.0 (talk) 02:15, 21 October 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Lack of Any Citations

The article is a really bad one with only one citation on some information in the introduction. It needs to be completely revamped with verified, reliable material.

For example, the "Strong Fighter" section does not cite any resources and makes very strong claims about Alfonso protecting Muslims within his kingdom that need to be proven before being put up here.

Khateeb88 (talk) 03:12, 24 January 2012 (UTC)[reply]

I agree, the article is in need of much work. Thank you for volunteering. Agricolae (talk) 23:00, 2 March 2012 (UTC)[reply]

Alfonso VI of León, not Castille

Contrary to what many people think and say, Urraca, Alfonso VI and Alfonso VII never consider themselves kings of Castille. There are no historical records of that afirmation. The first king of Castille was Sancho I, brother of Alfonso VI. When he died Alfonso never considered Castille an independent kingdom. The next king of Castille was Sancho II, son of Alfonso VII who separate Leon and Castille as two different kingdoms. This wrong information should be revised and corrected. 154.28.188.237 (talk) 14:46, 14 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

Wikipedia does not follow titulature found in contemporary records, but how the subject is treated by modern scholars, who take historical events, which are by definition unique, into historical patterns by making generalizations. What do they call him? Reilly calls Alfonso 'king of Leon-Castile' and elsewhere 'Alfonso de Leon y Castilla', and the same style is used by Montenegro and by García de Cortázar, while similarly Mackey calls him 'Alfonso VI of Leon and Castile', and Estepa and Mozo call him 'Alfonso VI, rey de Leon y Castilla'. Espinar, Santamaria and Salazar call him simply 'Alfonso VI de Castilla'. To Castro and Gonzalez he is 'Alfonso VI de Castilla y Leon'. That all from a quick survey of Dialnet, so it does not appear that there is a scholarly consensus along the lines you are arguing. Agricolae (talk) 15:41, 14 October 2020 (UTC)[reply]

The reason for such confusion is that in the Middle Ages, titulature was often not standardized, and the sources of the time could sometimes commit mistakes when recording them, which many modern authors repeat, resulting in a mess. As in most of Europe at this time however, the same person could come to rule several kingdoms by legally succeeding in each of their thrones separately, that's what matters. There's a similar confusion in the Wikipedia pages of many medieval European monarchs because of this. Alfonso was VI of Leon, I of Galicia AND II of Castille, all of which were their own kingdoms. Wareno (talk) 23:03, 26 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]