File talk:Orthodox Christian Scout Association.svg

Non-free usage in Arab and Druze Scouts Movement

The non-free use rationale provided for the file states that it is being used in the infobox of Arab and Druze Scouts Movement as the primary means of identification. This is not the case at all, however. The file is being used in Arab and Druze Scouts Movement#Member organizations in a bullet-list with other non-free logos. This type of usage in for individual entries in lists in generally not allowed per WP:NFLISTS because it tends to be decorative and not satisfy WP:NFCC#8. I could see the image being used in the infobox of a stand-alone article about the Orthodox Christian Scout Association if such an article existed, but not in this particular article since there is no sourced discussion of the logo itself which means omitting it is not really going to be detrimental to the reader's understanding. Another problem is that none of the sourcing information required by WP:NFCC#10a is provided for copyright verification. Simply saying the source is the "collection of Chris" is not sufficient, unless possibly the copyright holder of the image is the same Chris. -- Marchjuly (talk) 02:38, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

I tried to remove the excessive usage of non-free images on the Arab and Druze Scouts Movement page however User:Kintetsubuffalo has reverted my attempts twice so i didn't wan't to push it. I agree they are in violation of the fair use rules and should be removed. Once removed from the Arab and Druze Scouts Movement page, the File:Druze Scout Association.png will only have a single usage over at its main page Druze Scouts Association and so should qualify for minimal usage. The other two image (File:Israel Greek Orthodox Scouts Association.svg, File:Catholic Scout Association in Israel.png) should be deleted. Salavat (talk) 03:50, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

Thanks for the clarification Salavat. The image has been tagged with {{di-fails NFCC}} so it will be eventually evaluated by an administrator to see whether it qualifies for speedy deletion. Administrators are supposed to check a file's talk page for comments before deleting it image. The reviewing admin will take everything written into account and then decide what to do. It's possible that the administrator may decide to delete the image outright or that there is no clear-cut reason for speedy deletion and that further discussion is needed. If the latter is the case and you still feel the image's usage violates WP:NFCC, you can open a thread about it at WP:FFD. You can create threads at FFD about any other image whose non-free usage you feel should be evaluated and discussed. Much like a discussions at WP:AFD, FFD gives other editors the chance to examine the situation and reach a consensus on what needs to be done. The consensus could be that everything is fine so do nothing, the file should be deleted outright, or the file should be kept, but only be used in a certain article in a certain way. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:05, 26 January 2016 (UTC)

Keep. One use of an image throughout Wikipedia is in no way "excessive use". These religio-ethnic organizations are so small they may never have their own Wikipedia article, but they are worthwhile topics nonetheless. Let's come up with a better solution. Their addition can be argued to be compliant, and I argue thus.--Kintetsubuffalo (talk) 04:11, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

Israel Greek Orthodox Scouts Association may be a worthwhile topic and perhaps someday an article or stub will be created if WP:GNG (WP:ORG) can be met, but being a worthwhile topic is not really a justification for using a non-free image like this one is currently being used. This particular usage does not seem to comply with WP:NFCC because of WP:NFCC#8 and WP:NFCC#10a. Usage like this in individual entries of an embedded list is typically considered decorative because such images tend to be added more to be seen than as the subject of any sourced commentary about the image. That's pretty much been the standard applied for the usage of similar files in past NFCR/FFD discussions.

I'm not sure if [1], [2], [3], [4], [5], [6], [7], [8], [9], [10] are related to the Israel Greek Orthodox Scouts Association organization in any way, but all that is needed per WP:ORGDEPTH is two independent items of significant coverage to create a stub. It is much easier to justify non-free usage, particularly with respect to NFCC#8, when an image is used as the primary means of identification in a stand-alone article/stub because it is assumed that the context required by NFCC#8 comes from the article content and its supporting sources.

Finally, if the file was freely licensed, none of the above would really matter, and the file could then be used pretty much without any restrictions on Wikipedia other than WP:IUP. However, without knowing more specific information about the source (e.g., who created it and when, who holds the copyright, when it was first published, etc.), it's hard to verify it's copyright information per Wikipedia:Non-U.S. copyrights. For example, Template:PD-Israel-Photo can be used with photos which satisfy certain conditions. There are also files such as File:Emblem of Israel.svg on Commons which are freely licensed. Maybe there's a clue buried somewhere in c:Category:Coats of arms of Israel as to how this file could possibly be freely licensed. Simply saying it's from "the collection of ... " or "the property of ..." is almost surely not going to be seen as enough by Commons. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:19, 28 January 2016 (UTC)

• This used in Arab and Druze Scouts Movement, but it is not the logo of an entity called 'Arab and Druze Scouts Movement', and the image violates WP:NFCC#8 on that page. It is sourced to a Wikipedia user's personal collection, so I suppose that the source is a badge in that user's collection. I'm not sure how to best indicate that a badge is the source of an image. Books, websites and other sources have attributes (such as URLs or titles) which badges normally don't have. --Stefan2 (talk) 00:44, 29 January 2016 (UTC)